QA/Meetings/20110328

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Contents

Attendees

People present (lines said):

  • jlaska (168)
  • kparal (85)
  • adamw (62)
  • Viking-Ice (34)
  • tflink (30)
  • vhumpa (29)
  • nirik (15)
  • zodbot (6)
  • Venemo_N900 (3)
  • jskladan (2)
  • mkrizek (2)
  • Cerlyn (1)
  • robatino (1)
  • jsmith (1)

Unable to attend:

  1. Rhe (hopefully sleeping)
  2. Hongqing (hopefully sleeping)
  3. Twu (hopefully sleeping)

Agenda

Previous meeting follow-up

  1. jlaska - provide updated boot.iso for testing new lorax+anaconda builds so testers can provide karma

Rescheduling GNOME3 test day

  • The test day is scheduled on 7th of April now, which collides with the GNOME3 release again
  • Reschedule for Apr 21st - plenty of time before F-15 final change deadline

Upcoming QA events

Tuesday, March 29 - Beta 'Test Compose'

Tuesday, March 29 - Printing Test Day

Thursday, March 31 - ABRT/Retrace Server Test Day

Friday, April 1 - F-15-Beta Blocker #4

Open discussion - <Your topic here>

AutoQA Updates

  • https://kparal.wordpress.com/2011/03/21/autoqa-will-be-providing-comments-for-fedora-updates-really-soon/
  • Bodhi should be fixed now, thanks lmacken for quick response.
  • As for AutoQA, we're working on fine-tuning all those errors and would like to make a bugfix release soon (next week? just a guess).
  • ACTION: tflink will gather a list of stale -pending tags and determine whether autoqa or bodhi bug
  • tflink added new method to our library allowing us to easily download RPMs for a specific build
  • vhumpa committed a patch splitting watcher scripts and event definitions into separate directories (abolishing 'hook' word). That should make the architecture more comprehensible. He's now in the process of adjusting wiki documentation to reflect it.
  • jskladan has provided patches for upgradepath, which was incorrectly reporting results to updates consisting of more than 1 build
  • AutoQA will following a proper versioning scheme from now on. Major number bump for very large changes, minor number bump for standard feature additions and standard-size changes, and revision number bump for bugfix releases.
  • We have even created 'stable' git branch that should always contain the latest stable code (released or about to be released).

NetworkManager-0.9 and libreoffice status check

Handling HTML email to test@lists.fp.org

  • Viking-Ice offered a proposal to update mailman settings to enable convert_html_to_plaintxt to automatically convert HTML emails to plaintext
    • The group agreed with this change
  • Viking-Ice also suggested rejecting HTML messages, with a customized response pointing people to Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
    • The group didn't reach consensus on whether auto-rejecting emails was a good first response for contributors

Pending website change

Nightly live ISO URLs

Action items

  1. vhumpa reach out to reschedule GnomeShell #3 for April 21
  2. tflink to handle announcements for Printing test day
  3. tflink looking into stale -pending tags and determine whether autoqa or bodhi bug
  4. nirik will look into updating the nightly-composes directory to eliminate any 404's

IRC Log

jlaska #startmeeting Fedora QA Meeting 15:00
zodbot Meeting started Mon Mar 28 15:00:16 2011 UTC. The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 15:00
zodbot Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 15:00
jlaska #meetingname fedora-qa 15:00
zodbot The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa' 15:00
jlaska #topic Roll Call 15:00
* tflink is present 15:00
* kparal is here 15:00
* mkrizek visits 15:00
jlaska Hello gang ... show of electronic hands time 15:00
jlaska woah ... welcome back mkrizek! 15:00
jlaska Hello tflink + kparal 15:01
* vhumpa hello there! 15:01
jlaska howdy vhumpa 15:01
kparal mkrizek: looking forward to hearing autoqa updates? :-) 15:01
jlaska Anyone else lurking? robatino Viking-Ice adamw ? 15:02
* robatino is here 15:02
* jlaska greets 15:02
mkrizek kparal: yep, can't wait:) 15:02
jlaska okay, let's get started 15:02
jlaska btw ... I may have to go on radio silence for a moment during the meeting. kparal was kind enough to agree to co #chair 15:03
jlaska #chair kparal 15:03
zodbot Current chairs: jlaska kparal 15:03
jlaska I'll be walking through the agenda posted on the wiki - https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Meetings/20110328 15:03
* jsmith lurks 15:03
jlaska lurker! 15:03
jlaska #topic Previous meeting follow-up 15:03
jlaska We had 3 items on the list, 2 of which pertain to test days, so we can cover those when we review ucoming QA events 15:04
jlaska Hey, there's jskladan! 15:04
* jskladan lurks 15:04
jskladan jlaska: hey there 15:04
jlaska #info jlaska - provide updated boot.iso for testing new lorax+anaconda builds so testers can provide karma 15:04
jlaska So thanks to everyone who helped test the newer anaconda and lorax builds last week 15:04
* jlaska looking at robatino 15:04
* Viking-Ice checks in 15:04
jlaska I just updated my boot.iso to include the proposed anaconda-15.25-1 and NM-0.9 updates 15:05
jlaska Hey Viking 15:05
jlaska I'll send another request out to the list, but we have another anaconda update that needs some karma so it can land in Beta TC1 15:05
jlaska #link https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/anaconda-15.25-1.fc15 15:05
jlaska That's all from me on this one 15:05
jlaska anything I missed from last week? 15:06
jlaska alright then, let's dive in 15:06
jlaska #topic Rescheduling GNOME3 test day 15:06
jlaska vhumpa requested adding this topic 15:06
jlaska I believe we may need adamw around for this though 15:06
vhumpa Yes, he needs to be around 15:07
jlaska vhumpa: can you highlight the problem again, for the minutes? 15:07
vhumpa jlaska: of course 15:07
tflink  :q 15:08
tflink sorry, wrong window 15:08
jlaska tflink: heh 15:08
vhumpa The test day is scheduled on 7th of April now, which colides with the GNOME3 release again 15:08
jlaska #info The test day is scheduled on 7th of April now, which colides with the GNOME3 release again 15:08
Viking-Ice the third time then right ;) 15:08
vhumpa So, like last time, there would likely be a need to push important updates to the test day image at the last moment 15:09
kparal when's the release date? 15:09
vhumpa Which seems to make problems, notably to AdamW's sleep :) 15:09
vhumpa kparal: 7th April 15:09
kparal vhumpa: ah, I see 15:09
vhumpa Thus we though to move the test day to later date 15:09
vhumpa Next week though is a virtualization test day 15:10
Viking-Ice reschedule the Gnome 3 test after the upstream release ? 15:10
vhumpa viking-ice: yes 15:10
kparal well, does it have to be Thursday? I know it's common practice, but what about Friday? 15:10
jlaska Just trying to find a good fit ... and not interfere with any other test events 15:10
kparal or other day next week? 15:10
vhumpa First free slot is on 21st, which might just be too late 15:10
jlaska vhumpa: adamw proposed the Tuesday before the virt event 15:11
Viking-Ice you dont have to stick with the slots 15:11
vhumpa kparal: it doesnt 15:11
jlaska I was just concerned that we might overload that week with two *large* test days (GNOME3 and Virt) 15:11
vhumpa Also no problem with multiple test days per week 15:11
vhumpa The issue is exactly what jlaska just mentioned 15:11
vhumpa So, what we can do... 15:11
Viking-Ice the upcoming printing test day was not set on a "schedule" slot 15:11
vhumpa Move the test day just to 8th (Friday) and hope the extra day gives time to evade trouble 15:12
Viking-Ice and date that suited the maintainer was simply found.. 15:12
jlaska vhumpa: the upstream release is on Apr 7th, right? 15:13
tflink is 1 day going to be enough for the released packages to get into repos? 15:13
vhumpa jlaska: yes I think so 15:13
jlaska I don't think so 15:13
Viking-Ice just simply ask the Gnome desktop team when it's best for them to hold the test day ? 15:13
jlaska Let's at least push the test day to the following week? 15:13
vhumpa Likely Nope... 15:13
jlaska vhumpa: I think Viking-Ice has the right approach 15:14
vhumpa We could also talk to virt guys to swap 15:14
Viking-Ice you dont have to swap 15:14
jlaska definitely 15:14
Venemo_N900 am I late for the QA meeting? 15:14
jlaska Venemo_N900: nope, welcome 15:14
vhumpa Let's ask the deskop guys then 15:15
jlaska vhumpa: from there we can adjust/swap if needed 15:15
Viking-Ice yup 15:15
jlaska vhumpa: you want to reach out to desktop@ ? 15:15
vhumpa jlaska: Will do 15:15
jlaska excellent, thanks 15:15
jlaska adamw noted he may have already started discussion on this topic, but I don't know if a date was ever selected 15:16
vhumpa We have a bunch of them here, so no problem asking :) 15:16
jlaska yeah 15:16
jlaska #topic Upcoming QA events 15:16
kparal #action vhumpa reach out to desktop team to disscuss best day for upcoming test day 15:16
jlaska kparal: can you take over ... ? 15:16
kparal jlaska: ok 15:17
kparal Tuesday, March 29 - Beta 'Test Compose' 15:17
kparal jlaska - will provide updated boot.iso for testing new lorax+anaconda builds so testers can provide karma 15:17
kparal I think jlaska already covered this 15:17
kparal he will send out email asking for help in testing the new builds 15:18
kparal Tuesday, March 29 - Printing Test Day 15:18
Venemo_N900 may I have a few suggestions regarding the desktop in F15? 15:18
Venemo_N900 I'm not sure if this is the right place to discuss 15:18
kparal tflink to check in with twaugh on preparations for printing test day 15:19
kparal Venemo_N900: in #fedora-qa or on desktop channel 15:19
kparal tflink: do you have some updates on this? 15:19
tflink I sent an email to twaugh asking about the status of the test day. I heard back from him on tuesday, saying that he hadn't forgotten but had been busy 15:20
kparal the wiki seems kind of ready 15:20
tflink he said that he was planning to send out an announcement later that day (also in qa trac #172) 15:20
kparal I think it wasn't sent yet 15:21
tflink I don't believe that I saw an announcement for the test day, though 15:21
tflink I'll poke him about sending that out today 15:21
kparal tflink: ok, can you try to contact twaugh about the announcement or send it yourself? 15:21
kparal thanks 15:21
tflink either/or. I would want to make sure that they're ready before sending out the announcement, though 15:22
kparal tflink: sure 15:22
kparal #action tflink to handle announcements for Printing test day 15:22
kparal one more thing 15:22
kparal there seems to be a change of URLs for nightly composes 15:23
kparal this doesn't work any more: http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/nightly-composes/desktop/ 15:23
kparal instead see http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/nightly-composes/current.html 15:23
kparal so it's not as easy to link to a current image from the wiki page 15:23
kparal we will have to decide whether to link to an image from a particular day, or link to current.html page (may be confusing for people) 15:24
adamw oh fer... 15:24
adamw why do i never seem to be able to get meeting times right lately 15:24
adamw hi 15:24
kparal adamw: hello! 15:24
kparal ok, if there is nothing to add to Printing Test Day... 15:25
adamw we might want to do more about the nightly URL thing 15:25
adamw but we can put that in open discussion... 15:25
* jlaska back 15:26
kparal adamw: ok, let's put it there 15:26
kparal adamw: please read backlog about gnome3 test day date and comment if you have something further on your mind 15:26
kparal next on: 15:26
kparal Thursday, March 31 - ABRT/Retrace Server Test Day 15:26
kparal # kparal to check with jmoskovc what is needed about ABRT test day 15:26
adamw kparal: i already reached out to desktop team about changing the date, the thread never really went anywhere. 15:27
adamw at this point we should probably just do it. 15:27
adamw but we can come back to it later 15:27
kparal adamw: lets go back to that later, thanks 15:27
kparal so, abrt test day 15:27
kparal I did checked and was told that abrt guys were working on those test cases 15:27
kparal they don't need any wiki help 15:28
jlaska cool, [X] Check! :) 15:28
kparal but they might need to build a custom LiveCD if nightly compose is not good enough for them 15:28
kparal I offered my services in that case 15:28
kparal apart from that, they didn't ask for anything else 15:28
jlaska thanks ... we also have help from EDT and PDT if needed for building the ISO's 15:28
* kparal not familiar with those abbreviations 15:29
jlaska sorry, just timezones (eastern-US and pacific-US) 15:29
kparal ah, yes 15:29
kparal ok, /me giving mic back to jlaska 15:29
kparal we can go back to gnome3 test day or go forth to the next topic 15:30
jlaska kparal: rats, you were doing good! :) 15:30
jlaska #info Friday, April 1 - F-15-Beta Blocker #4 15:30
jlaska Just a reminder ... the fourth beta blocker review will be hosted again this Friday 15:31
jlaska #link http://bit.ly/f15-beta-blocker-proposed 15:31
jlaska #link http://bit.ly/f15-beta-blocker-accepted 15:31
jlaska kparal: I think that's it for upcoming events, did I miss any? 15:31
jlaska if not ... we'll jump back to GNOME3 15:32
kparal I don't think so 15:32
jlaska okay, thanks for driving 15:32
jlaska #topic Rescheduling GNOME3 test day 15:32
adamw so yeah, i think waiting for desktop team on this may not work 15:32
jlaska okay ... with adamw here now ... is there anything else to discuss on this topic? 15:32
adamw they seem to take a 'ok, whatever' approach to scheduling - at every point i asked for their input but then just went ahead and did it 15:32
jlaska okay 15:33
vhumpa I just got exactly that from one of them :) 15:33
vhumpa Well, actually - I was wrong about the release day 15:34
adamw so, wait a sec, the open slot we have is 21st? 15:34
vhumpa It is on 6th 15:34
vhumpa adamw: yes 15:34
adamw i think i've been looking at an old calendar when being worried about that date 15:34
adamw now we have a two week slip, 21st actually should be fine 15:34
adamw final change deadline isn't till may 9th, now 15:35
adamw so i think we can probably just go ahead with 21st, unless anyone else is worried about it 15:35
vhumpa adamw: that sounds good 15:35
jlaska no worries here 15:35
vhumpa Also makes a buffer time if something goes wrong with G3 release finally 15:36
adamw true 15:36
jlaska #info Reschedule for Apr 21st - plenty of time before F-15 final change deadline 15:37
jlaska thanks vhumpa + adamw 15:37
jlaska #topic Open Discussion - <your topic here> 15:37
jlaska That's all I had on the agenda for today 15:37
jlaska Any topics folks would like to cover? 15:38
* kparal proposes AutoQA updates 15:38
* vhumpa is running home 15:38
jlaska vhumpa: cya 15:38
* kparal created quite some notes in advance 15:38
jlaska #topic AutoQA Updates 15:38
jlaska kparal: take it away when you are ready 15:38
kparal mkrizek: wake up, the time has come :) 15:38
jlaska hehe 15:39
kparal I'd like to shortly recapitulate the latest news about AutoQA and its "send Bodhi comments" feature. As you probably noticed, I posted the following message as a blogpost and into devel and test lists: 15:39
kparal #link https://kparal.wordpress.com/2011/03/21/autoqa-will-be-providing-comments-for-fedora-updates-really-soon/ 15:39
kparal After we enabled Bodhi commenting last week, a lot of problems popped up. That was certainly expected, although not desired. We turned off the feature after only a single hour or so, because we received many reports of misbehaviour. It turned out that some mistakes were caused by AutoQA bugs, some mistakes were caused by Bodhi bugs. 15:39
kparal #info Bodhi should be fixed now, thanks lmacken for quick response. 15:39
kparal #info As for AutoQA, we're working on fine-tuning all those errors and would like to make a bugfix release soon (next week? just a guess). Then we will turn the commenting feature on again. 15:40
jlaska yeah, that was some fast action resolving that stuff 15:40
tflink it looks like there are some packages with stale tags hanging around still 15:40
jlaska tflink: do you have a script you are using to detect? 15:40
kparal tflink: if you have some links, feel free to create a ticket for bodhi and CC us, thanks 15:40
tflink nope, just looking at the upgradepath results 15:40
kparal tflink: well, there were some bugs in upgradepath 15:41
* tflink will put together a list of stale tags today and submit a ticket 15:41
kparal tflink: builds containing epoch were not detected correctly 15:41
kparal it's better to check manually using "koji" command or so 15:41
tflink kparal: OK, I was planning to double check with koji before submitting anyways 15:42
kparal tflink: great 15:42
jlaska #action tflink will gather a list of stale -pending tags and determine whether autoqa or bodhi bug 15:42
jlaska tflink: thx 15:42
tflink jlaska: np 15:42
kparal so, I'll post another email/blogpost when we're nearing the date when we should enable Bodhi comments again 15:42
kparal I also expect this whole cycle to repeat itself a few times untill we have it all perfectly running. 15:42
kparal That's all from the recap. A few notes about other recent updates: 15:43
kparal #info tflink added new method to our library allowing us to easily download RPMs for a specific build 15:43
kparal This is his first push to master IIRC, yay! :) 15:43
jlaska I'll stay tuned to do a new stable tag + build when requested 15:43
jlaska first of many, I'm sure 15:44
kparal definitely 15:44
kparal And similarly for vhumpa: 15:44
kparal #info vhumpa committed a patch splitting watcher scripts and event definitions into separate directories (abolishing 'hook' word). That should make the architecture more comprehensible. He's now in the process of adjusting wiki documentation to reflect it. 15:44
tflink I should hope so. I'd be worried if my only contribution to autoqa was a single utility method :-D 15:44
jlaska tflink: haha! 15:44
kparal And jskladan wasn't idle either: 15:45
kparal #info jskladan has provided patches for upgradepath, which was incorrectly reporting results to updates consisting of more than 1 build 15:45
kparal Not yet in master, it will be there any time soon. 15:45
jlaska kparal: I gather that'll also land in stable? 15:45
kparal jlaska: yes 15:45
jlaska cool 15:45
jlaska nice work gang ... looking forward to 0.4.5-1 15:45
kparal which reminds me... 15:46
kparal #info AutoQA will following a better versioning scheme from now on. Major number bump for very large changes, minor number bump for standard feature additions and standard-size changes, and revision number bump for bugfix releases. Roughly :) That should help our packages to be more predictible and easily distinguish bugfix releases from feature releases or packaging changes. 15:46
kparal #info We have even created 'stable' git branch that should always contain the latest stable code (released or about to be released). 15:46
jlaska kparal: and by better, you mean "actual" ... and note my lazy release bump method  :) 15:46
jlaska s/note/not/ 15:46
* jlaska got caught being lazy 15:47
* kparal is denying that 15:47
jlaska Anything else on AutoQA? 15:47
kparal ok, that's all from AutoQA world for today 15:47
jlaska thanks for the updates 15:47
jlaska #topic Open Discussion - <your topic here> 15:48
jlaska I had a quick question ... anyone know what the latest build status is for the NM-0.9 stuff? 15:48
jlaska I see a bodhi update ... I'm guessing we're just waiting for the repo to update? 15:48
jlaska #link https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/pidgin-2.7.11-2.fc15,telepathy-glib-0.14.1-1.fc15,telepathy-logger-0.2.6-1.fc15,libsocialweb-0.25.11-3.fc15,kdebase-runtime-4.6.1-3.fc15,epiphany-2.91.92-2.fc15,evolution-2.91.92-2.fc15,control-center-2.91.92-3.fc15,kde-plasma-networkmanagement-0.9-0.44.20110323.fc15,kdebase-workspace-4.6.1-5.fc15,empathy-2.91.92-2.fc15,geoclue-0.12.0-7.fc15,krb5-auth-dialog-2.91.91-3.fc15,gnome-shell-2.91. 15:49
adamw jlaska: yes, as far as the system is concerned, it's stable. 15:49
jlaska ouch 15:49
adamw so if you don't have it yet, it's just compose / mirror sync 15:49
jlaska okay 15:49
jlaska cool ... and what's up with libreoffice, is that in the same boat? 15:49
jlaska #link https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/libreoffice-3.3.2.2-2.fc15 15:49
adamw 3.3.2.2-2.fc15 has been submitted but not pushed 15:50
Viking-Ice I want to mention one thing 15:50
adamw the summary screen on bodhi is actually more useful when checking this, btw 15:50
adamw see https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/search/libreoffice 15:50
adamw it makes it really obvious 15:50
jlaska adamw: ah I see, thanks 15:51
jlaska Viking-Ice: what's up? 15:51
jlaska #info libreoffice and NM-0.9 updates working through system and should hit mirrors soon 15:51
Viking-Ice I propose that we enable we convert_html_to_plaintxt option in mailman and reject the message on the bases that it it violates the list guide lines and provide http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines#No_HTML_Mail.2C_Please. . for the test list 15:51
Viking-Ice one too many we there.. 15:52
jlaska have a few HTML messages landed recently? 15:52
Viking-Ice yup 15:52
adamw um, can we finish discussing networkmanager update first? 15:52
Viking-Ice yup 15:52
jlaska adamw: oh, didn't realize we were still discussing it, what'd I miss? 15:52
adamw so one thing we should probably do is check and confirm other desktops are okay 15:53
adamw is knetworkmanager working okay for everyone in kde, is nm-applet actually still working in lxde/xfce 15:53
jlaska if we want to do this prior to TC1, we have a small window to build custom live images 15:53
jlaska #topic NM-0.9 update status 15:53
adamw yeah. i can build some for myself to test but uploading them for anyone else would take ages. 15:53
adamw other thing you can do, of course, is just test on an installed system 15:53
adamw yum install @desktop_of_choice 15:53
jlaska #info the bodhi update is working it's way through, and will hit compose/mirror_sync soon 15:54
nirik adamw: works in xfce here. :) had to reboot tho after the update. 15:54
jlaska #info nirik reported that XFCE works well with NM-0.9 update 15:54
adamw nirik: great 15:54
jlaska I think I saw confirmation of knetworkmanager in the bodhi update 15:54
jlaska anyone want to volunteer for LXDE confirmation? 15:55
adamw i can check it. 15:55
adamw i'll look at the others too, just in case. 15:55
Viking-Ice I could have had my T61p not broken down.. 15:55
jlaska #info adamw volunteer to test LXDE + NM-0.9 15:55
adamw if it works in xfce, though, i don't expect any problems 15:56
jlaska adamw: I need to knock out testing of custom boot.iso and DVD.iso stuff ... I expect that'll chew up my afternoon 15:56
adamw funsies 15:56
jlaska anything else on this topic? 15:56
jlaska #topic Proposal to enable convert_html_to_plaintxt 15:57
jlaska okay, now to Viking-Ice's topic 15:57
Viking-Ice So basically The convert_html_to_plaintxt option tells Mailman to strip all HTML from the message and deliver it as plain text. 15:57
adamw no objections from me 15:57
jlaska yeah, this seems like a "good thing" 15:57
jlaska I'll go make the change if no one objects 15:58
Viking-Ice yeah but we should set a filter rule and reject the message 15:58
jlaska Viking-Ice: so you want to convert to plaintext, *and* reject ? 15:58
Viking-Ice referring to the mailing list guidelines 15:58
Viking-Ice jlaska: yup enforce and educate at the same time 15:59
adamw i don't see the point in converting if we're going to reject it 15:59
Cerlyn Adding the rejection seems kind of silly; many mail clients do not make it obvious how to send plain text on a per-recipient basis 15:59
jlaska yeah, that seems odd 15:59
Viking-Ice yeah my mistake 15:59
Viking-Ice not up to speed in mailman filters though you had to enable then filter for some wierd reason 15:59
jlaska +1 on the convert_to_plaintext 16:00
adamw +1 16:00
Viking-Ice by simply converting you dont educate user(s) at the same time 16:00
jlaska Viking-Ice: it was your proposal ... do you want to change it? 16:00
Viking-Ice yes rather reject but fall on converting if that fails ;) 16:01
jlaska would you rather automatically reject mails with HTML? 16:01
Viking-Ice as in fails to be agreed 16:01
Viking-Ice jlaska: yup filter rule reject referring to mailing list guidelines 16:01
jlaska I'll need to look into that with mailman, and I'll let you know 16:02
jlaska I'm sure it's possible, I just haven't done it 16:02
Viking-Ice enforcing and educate instead of just work around 16:02
jlaska if I can customize the rejection response to point to the guildeines, I have no objections 16:03
Viking-Ice great 16:03
jlaska any objections to auto-reject w/ friendly response? 16:03
adamw sure, whatever 16:03
tflink not sure that rejection is the best idea if we're trying to get new pre-release users to send email to test@ 16:03
jlaska #agreed Update mailman settings for test@ to auto-reject HTML messages, and reply with list guidelines 16:03
jlaska #undo 16:04
zodbot Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Agreed object at 0x34137150> 16:04
* tflink is slow, aparrantly 16:04
Viking-Ice tflink: they are violating the guidelines 16:04
Viking-Ice they need to be educated 16:04
Viking-Ice instead of us working around the problem 16:04
tflink is rejecting someone's first email to a list the best way to educate them? 16:05
jlaska I'm going to enable the plaintext conversion for now 16:05
Viking-Ice tflink: and refering to the mailing list guidelines yes 16:05
kparal let's convert to plaintext and accept, but send nagmail back asking for no html next time. is that possible? 16:05
jlaska and we'll continue this discussion on #fedora-qa or on the list (without using HTML messages) 16:05
jlaska #agreed Update mailman settings to enable convert_html_to_plaintext 16:05
Viking-Ice  ? 16:06
jlaska is this worth a lot of time? 16:06
jlaska meaning, do we really have a ton of test@ mails containing HTML? 16:06
adamw let's just agree and move on 16:06
jlaska let's quick fix with the conversion, and politely educate users when it happens 16:06
jlaska anything else for today? 16:07
Viking-Ice right support their broken behaviour 16:07
jlaska we're over time ... so if not, I'll #endmeeting shortly 16:07
tflink one small thing 16:07
tflink sorry, I just remembered 16:07
tflink regarding a pending website change 16:07
jlaska Viking-Ice: it's about approach/attitude ... your idea is sound, we just don't want to tell them to piss off on their first post 16:08
jlaska #topic Pending website change 16:08
jlaska tflink: take it 16:08
Viking-Ice jlaska: depends on how you phrase the reply 16:08
jlaska Viking-Ice: agreed, and when the phrasing is a mailman rejection ... that stucks 16:08
jlaska s/stucks/sucks/ 16:08
tflink after a conversation with a new user on friday, I sent this email out to the test@ list about new user feedback http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-March/098160.html 16:09
tflink A ticket was filed with fedora-websites to add a notice that all pre-release feedback should be directed to #fedora-qa or test@ 16:09
adamw yay 16:09
tflink https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-websites/ticket/45 16:09
jlaska hmm, I wonder if that explains the rise in chatter 16:09
tflink that request has been accepted and the change is scheduled for beta release 16:10
jlaska cool, good to know this workflow also 16:10
jlaska tflink: thx for follow-up 16:10
adamw nice one tflink 16:10
tflink jlaska: np 16:11
jlaska #info A ticket was filed with fedora-websites to add a notice that all pre-release feedback should be directed to #fedora-qa or test@ 16:11
jlaska #topic Open Discussion - last call 16:11
* jlaska sets the fuse at 1 minute 16:11
adamw oh 16:12
adamw one more 16:12
adamw #topic nightly URLs 16:12
jlaska darnit! 16:12
jlaska  ;) 16:12
jlaska #chair adamw 16:12
zodbot Current chairs: adamw jlaska kparal 16:12
adamw #topic nightly URLs 16:12
adamw thanks 16:12
jlaska take it my good man 16:12
adamw so as we noticed earlier - nightly generation is being done by koji now 16:12
adamw so all the URLs changed 16:12
jlaska oh, good reminder 16:12
adamw the old URLs were pretty widely distributed; it'd be nice if we could get any URL under that whole tree to redirect somewhere sane 16:12
jlaska #info nightly generation is being done by koji now, so the URLs changed 16:13
* kparal is not happy when X restarts suddenly 16:13
adamw right now you just get a 404, which doesn't give you any clue where to look 16:13
jlaska kparal: :( 16:13
adamw nirik: any input? 16:13
jlaska does the Release/Branched wiki need an update 16:13
* jlaska checks 16:13
* nirik looks up 16:13
nirik I guess I could see about a redirect... 16:14
nirik or I could make the old dirs and put links back to the top in or something. 16:14
jlaska for the logs ... what's the new location? 16:15
kparal is it possible to have always current link to last desktop image? 16:15
jlaska koji.fedoraproject.org ... 16:15
tflink http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/nightly-composes/current.html 16:15
adamw http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/nightly-composes/current.html 16:15
adamw doh, i lose 16:15
kparal but direct one 16:15
adamw tflink: you realize, of course, this means war 16:15
adamw yeah, it'd be nice to have a reliable direct link like we had before 16:15
* tflink is worried about what he started :-/ 16:15
tflink kparal: I don't think that there is a static link to the current nightly anymore 16:16
tflink since they're all koji builds 16:16
* nirik isn't sure what you are asking... 16:16
nirik a link to just the desktop composes? 16:16
adamw well, actually, current.html is about as good as what we had before 16:16
kparal not really 16:16
adamw before you could reliably get to the right directory but not direct to an iso 16:16
jlaska should current.html just be index.html? 16:16
adamw it's still two clicks 16:16
kparal yes, but if you link to current.html, some people might be confused. too much text there 16:17
nirik jlaska: I suppose it could be. 16:17
nirik can add a link there easily. 16:17
adamw nirik: and have any other URL under /nightly-composes just redirect there 16:17
kparal and btw finding iso on koji build page is not as easy as it used to be too 16:17
adamw it's not really hard, though. i don't wanna make a mountain out of a molehill, here... 16:18
kparal alright 16:18
nirik I'm happy to try and improve things... 16:18
jlaska nirik: I have some code that can push all this stuff into a wiki page if you want it there instead 16:18
nirik but this is much nicer IMHO than the old setup 16:18
jlaska yeah, takes the burden off of you for maintaining the build environment 16:19
nirik having composes in ~30min instead of 10hours and having 2 weeks of old ones is nice. 16:19
jlaska oh, that too! :) 16:19
jlaska #link http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/nightly-composes/current.html 16:19
jlaska adamw: anything else on this topic? 16:19
nirik well, currently it's still a script I have to run... I'd like to get it automated so I don't have to do anything, but figured it was far enough to put in place. 16:19
adamw nirik: just cleaning up the 404s would be enough for me 16:20
nirik which 404's? 16:20
nirik oh, right. 16:20
nirik will see what I can do 16:20
adamw nirik: basically as long as when you land in the nightly-composes tree you can find where you were trying to go, i'm happy 16:21
adamw i think that's all 16:22
jlaska #action nirik will look into updating the nightly-composes directory to eliminate any 404's 16:22
jlaska #topic Open discussion - last last last call 16:22
* jlaska sets fuse at 1 minute 16:22
jlaska thanks all! I'll send minutes to the list later on 16:23
jlaska Happy testing of TC1 when it lands this week :) 16:23
jlaska #endmeeting 16:23

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