ReleaseEngineering/Meetings/2007-oct-01

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Fedora Release Engineering Meeting :: Monday 2007-10-02

Fedora 8 Test 3

  • release candidate tree done (minus live images) which is synced to RDU
  • working through some problematic issues with live images right now
  • adding "new" packages now that need to be on the DVD would slip the release

Regular Fedora Releases on CD

  • we don't explain clearly anywhere why we don't do CD release anymore (regular ISOs not live image)
  • doing regular CD releases increases disk space on mirrors, compose time, and QA paths considerably
  • the i386 Live CD is usable in CD form, or the network based install options from rescue or boot.iso
  • creating CD sets can be created with existing free tools--LUGs can produce such things for their members, or whatever.
  • if CD releases were to be re-instituted the Fedora board would have to make decision that it is really important
  • QA would need to sign off
  • face possible wrath of the mirrors

IRC Transcript

f13jeremy: jwb: wwoods: spot: warren: rdieter: poelcat: notting: ping<a href="#t13:00" class="time">13:00</a>
* notting is here<a href="#t13:00" class="time">13:00</a>
jwbreal-life issues today.  going to miss<a href="#t13:00" class="time">13:00</a>
* spot is here<a href="#t13:01" class="time">13:01</a>
jeremyI'll be here in a second<a href="#t13:01" class="time">13:01</a>
* warren here<a href="#t13:01" class="time">13:01</a>
* poelcat here<a href="#t13:01" class="time">13:01</a>
* warren is soon testing live CD copied to USB<a href="#t13:02" class="time">13:02</a>
f13ugh.<a href="#t13:03" class="time">13:03</a>
spotugh?<a href="#t13:03" class="time">13:03</a>
f13note to self.  Don't try to do anything else on the net if moving an ISO via nfs through nautilus.<a href="#t13:03" class="time">13:03</a>
f13it dropped me from all but the local switch connections I had.<a href="#t13:03" class="time">13:03</a>
f13anywho.<a href="#t13:03" class="time">13:03</a>
Idea.png f13 changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora Releng: Fedora 8 Test 3<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
jeremy(back)<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
f13so we've got a release candidate tree done (minus live images), that I've synced to rdu<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
wwoodswhere in RDU?<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
f13and I've been banging on it for a bit.  I haven't ran into any stopships yet, I'm feeling pretty good.<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
f13wwoods: I sent that to you in msg<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
wwoodsI rebooted and lost it, sorry<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
f13you should have it now<a href="#t13:04" class="time">13:04</a>
wwoodscool, thank you<a href="#t13:05" class="time">13:05</a>
jeremysome of the live images at least are going to be problematic for now.  kde, for example<a href="#t13:06" class="time">13:06</a>
jeremyand we might want new NetworkManager in general.  working with dcbw as we speak<a href="#t13:06" class="time">13:06</a>
spotwe'll probably want new perl<a href="#t13:07" class="time">13:07</a>
spoti'm building the new package now<a href="#t13:07" class="time">13:07</a>
spot(fixes spamassassin)<a href="#t13:07" class="time">13:07</a>
warrenspot, the DB_File issue?  what was it?<a href="#t13:07" class="time">13:07</a>
spotwarren: i can show you the patch if you'd like, it was an uninitialized variable<a href="#t13:08" class="time">13:08</a>
warrenah, ok<a href="#t13:08" class="time">13:08</a>
f13uh..<a href="#t13:08" class="time">13:08</a>
f13please keep in mind that "new" packages now that would be on the DVD == slip of the release<a href="#t13:08" class="time">13:08</a>
spotf13: would you like to ship spamassassin non-functional?<a href="#t13:08" class="time">13:08</a>
f13spot: can it be fixed in an update?  this isn't a final release.<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
spotsure. it would just be broken on the DVD.<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
jeremywon't be the only thing ;)<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
wwoodsanything that can be fixed in an update and doesn't prevent people from installing / updating<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
f13heh<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
wwoodsis not a release blocker<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
wwoodsit sucks like whoa, but there it is<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
warrenjeremy, does the new NM show the right icon as connected when you login?<a href="#t13:09" class="time">13:09</a>
f13"new" ?<a href="#t13:10" class="time">13:10</a>
wwoods(the rules are different for final releases, natch)<a href="#t13:10" class="time">13:10</a>
f13I don't think it's been built yet.<a href="#t13:10" class="time">13:10</a>
jeremywarren: not what's there right now; dcbw has a patch from mclasen to fix that up<a href="#t13:10" class="time">13:10</a>
jeremyproposal: we can build the live images a little later and have more NetworkManager fixes<a href="#t13:10" class="time">13:10</a>
f13we can somewhat cheat with the Live images and pull in some slightly newer stuff, but that won't make it to the DVDs<a href="#t13:10" class="time">13:10</a>
jeremysince that's the way that most people who are hitting NetworkManager can get the fixes right off the bat<a href="#t13:11" class="time">13:11</a>
f13jeremy: +1<a href="#t13:11" class="time">13:11</a>
warrenMore important to get it out the door and unfreeze<a href="#t13:11" class="time">13:11</a>
f13but lets get a definition of what 'little later' means.<a href="#t13:11" class="time">13:11</a>
f13I don't necessarily want to let IS release it to mirrors without all the content there<a href="#t13:11" class="time">13:11</a>
jeremylater today/early early tomorrow<a href="#t13:12" class="time">13:12</a>
jeremyalso, the plan for the developer and FEL live images is to do them torrent only as hopefully they'll be able to be on the new spins.fedoraproject.org at release time if we can get all the ducks in a row there<a href="#t13:12" class="time">13:12</a>
f13jeremy: ok, that's probably OK, we can have IS stage and feed them the rest tomorrow, but their stage process doesn't lend itself to 'just resync against foo' :(<a href="#t13:12" class="time">13:12</a>
nottingthat's cutting it close<a href="#t13:12" class="time">13:12</a>
jeremyand as kde is likely hosed, we might want to put it torrent-only also (as that gives us more time to potentially get a working knetworkmanager)<a href="#t13:13" class="time">13:13</a>
nottinghosed b/c of NM, or hosed for other reasons?<a href="#t13:13" class="time">13:13</a>
f13nm<a href="#t13:13" class="time">13:13</a>
jeremyNM<a href="#t13:13" class="time">13:13</a>
warrennevermind =)<a href="#t13:14" class="time">13:14</a>
spoti thought i read that knetworkmanager was working<a href="#t13:16" class="time">13:16</a>
jeremyspot: lies<a href="#t13:16" class="time">13:16</a>
jeremyspot: it doesn't _build_, much less work<a href="#t13:16" class="time">13:16</a>
* jeremy spent some time last night and this morning trying to get it to build<a href="#t13:16" class="time">13:16</a>
notting'was being worked on'<a href="#t13:16" class="time">13:16</a>
jeremyI'll try to see if we can get the gnome nm-applet running with the kde livecd this afternoon as a short-term way to deal with things<a href="#t13:18" class="time">13:18</a>
f13k<a href="#t13:20" class="time">13:20</a>
f13in the mean time, I'm going to continue hitting test cases and getting say SHA1SUM files signed and stuff.<a href="#t13:21" class="time">13:21</a>
f13and figuring out a way to get these damned DVDs to burn.<a href="#t13:21" class="time">13:21</a>
f13I'll alert legal once we hand it off to IS<a href="#t13:21" class="time">13:21</a>
f13the Docs team is on the hook for a release announcement.<a href="#t13:22" class="time">13:22</a>
f13anything else anybody wants to bring up?<a href="#t13:23" class="time">13:23</a>
poelcatf13: got a quick on<a href="#t13:24" class="time">13:24</a>
nottingf13: ppc status?<a href="#t13:24" class="time">13:24</a>
f13poelcat: shoot.<a href="#t13:24" class="time">13:24</a>
f13notting: mostly working, X hosed on my mini and my G5<a href="#t13:24" class="time">13:24</a>
f13notting: I haven't seen a PPC gui in a while.  Going to take a DVD home and throw it at the PS3 tonight.<a href="#t13:25" class="time">13:25</a>
poelcatf13: do we clearly explain anywhere why we don't do CD release anymore (regular ISOs not live image)?<a href="#t13:26" class="time">13:26</a>
wwoodsX works fine on my g4 powerbook and g5 powermac<a href="#t13:26" class="time">13:26</a>
wwoodswell, the radeon in ght g5 is getting the monitor gamma wrongish still, but it works<a href="#t13:27" class="time">13:27</a>
jeremywwoods: ppc32 live cd coming up soon<a href="#t13:27" class="time">13:27</a>
wwoodsjeremy: seriously? I half-thought that was a joke<a href="#t13:27" class="time">13:27</a>
f13poelcat: I don't thin it's put clearly anywhere no :(<a href="#t13:27" class="time">13:27</a>
poelcatf13: will it ever be reconsidered?<a href="#t13:28" class="time">13:28</a>
jeremywwoods: I don't joke.<a href="#t13:28" class="time">13:28</a>
wwoodsjeremy: rad. Looking forward to it, then. I've got plenty of ppcs at home to mess with<a href="#t13:29" class="time">13:29</a>
f13poelcat: I'm not sure.  It increases disk space on mirrors, compose time, and QA paths considerably<a href="#t13:30" class="time">13:30</a>
jeremywwoods: good.  because there's not a lot of ppc32 hardware around here, so ...<a href="#t13:30" class="time">13:30</a>
poelcatf13: okay<a href="#t13:31" class="time">13:31</a>
f13poelcat: plus given the i386 Live CD that's usable in CD form, or the network based install options from rescue or boot.iso, it doesn't seem to be all that work the added cost to produce.<a href="#t13:31" class="time">13:31</a>
f13poelcat: and since the tools are free, places like LUGs can produce such things for their members, or whatever.<a href="#t13:31" class="time">13:31</a>
wwoodsjeremy: actually my wife's iMac is ppc64 but I've got 3 ppc32 machines handy<a href="#t13:31" class="time">13:31</a>
f13poelcat: that said, if the board decides that this is really important, and QA signs off on it, we'll go back tomaking them, and facing the wrath of the mirrors (:<a href="#t13:33" class="time">13:33</a>
poelcatf13: i see what you are saying, but i think there is still a large niche of new people that aren't giving fedora a real try because of this barrier<a href="#t13:35" class="time">13:35</a>
mdomschas long as there's a clean user experience with the LiveCDs for kickstarting like you could with the normal boot CDs<a href="#t13:35" class="time">13:35</a>
f13mdomsch: I don't follow<a href="#t13:35" class="time">13:35</a>
jeremymdomsch: there's not a clean user experience with kickstarting off of cd<a href="#t13:35" class="time">13:35</a>
mdomschahh, -1 then :-(<a href="#t13:36" class="time">13:36</a>
jeremymdomsch: there's not with kickstart off old install cds either, though<a href="#t13:36" class="time">13:36</a>
jeremymdomsch: switching cds is for the lose!<a href="#t13:36" class="time">13:36</a>
mdomschyeah<a href="#t13:37" class="time">13:37</a>
warren764M of x86_64 Live image<a href="#t13:37" class="time">13:37</a>
warrenwill that fit on a CD?<a href="#t13:37" class="time">13:37</a>
jeremyno.<a href="#t13:37" class="time">13:37</a>
jeremyhow many times do we have to go through this?<a href="#t13:37" class="time">13:37</a>
jeremyand I think we're off of rel-eng topics<a href="#t13:37" class="time">13:37</a>
jeremyso let's either get back on topic or I'd like to actually get back to fixing things for test3<a href="#t13:37" class="time">13:37</a>
warrenAnything more?<a href="#t13:38" class="time">13:38</a>
f13I got nothin.<a href="#t13:39" class="time">13:39</a>
f13warren: it'll fit on some of the newer special large CDRs<a href="#t13:39" class="time">13:39</a>
f13which are probably more rare than DVDRW drives<a href="#t13:39" class="time">13:39</a>
spotsignificantly more rare.<a href="#t13:39" class="time">13:39</a>

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