ReleaseEngineering/Meetings/2008-apr-07

Fedora Release Engineering Meeting :: Monday 2008-04-07

Fedora 9 Readiness

• Final freeze on Tuesday, April 8, 2008
• Internet2 issue could affect ability to feed mirrors at F9 GA
• Ongoing review of blocker bugs until GA

IRC Transcript

f13	ping: notting jeremy jwb wwoods warren lmacken poelcat rdieter	13:01
* poelcat here		13:02
f13	(wwoods is out)	13:02
* notting is here		13:02
* jwb is here		13:02
* lmacken is here		13:02
* warren here		13:02
f13	aight, lets get started.	13:03
-!- f13 changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora Release Engineering Meeting - Fedora 9 Final Freeze		13:03
f13	The final freeze is tomorrow, and as usual I'm going to setup an at job to throw the switch tonight so tomorrow's rawhide is the frozen content.	13:03
f13	I've got f9-final tag in koji already, and I'm updating it with the latest builds from dist-f9	13:04
notting	we're having an early tuesday freeze, not a late tuesday freeze?	13:04
f13	I'm going to start signing tonight too, if the clone finishes in time.	13:04
f13	notting: yeah, we did that for Alpha and Beta	13:04
f13	gives releng an extra day of testing	13:04
warren	how are we feeling about the stability of rawhide?  I had some worrying crashes during the weekend (no compiz involved)	13:04
f13	warren: I'm not "happy" but I'm not slitting my wrists yet.	13:05
poelcat	today's rawhide was good for me http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/JohnPoelstra/RawhideToday	13:05
jwb	rawhide has been fine for me since beta	13:05
jwb	with the exception of hibernate	13:06
jlaska	warren: I think it largely depends on what components you're interested in	13:06
f13	Well, I triggered a blocker bug this morning in anaconda, so that's lame for me	13:06
f13	and I still have to plow through this upgrade stuff.	13:06
warren	jlaska: oh nothing important, just dbus-daemon crashing, X deadlocking, and kernel oopsing	13:07
f13	upgrades in general are scary.	13:07
jwb	f13, what upgrade stuff?	13:07
jlaska	details details ;)	13:07
f13	jwb: finding things that went from multilib to not multilib and getting them blacklisted correctly in anaconda	13:07
jwb	ah	13:07
f13	jwb: plus finding other upgrade gotchas.	13:07
notting	i am concerned about our ability to deliver the preview, in light of mdomsch's discussion about final	13:07
f13	there are a number of upgrade related bugs on teh blocker list.	13:07
jwb	notting, wait... what?	13:07
f13	notting: preview is just going ot be torrent only	13:07
notting	ah, ok	13:07
jlaska	f13: so dumb question ... once we freeze, the plan is then to widdle down the blocker bug list?	13:07
notting	doom postponed!	13:08
f13	notting: it's like the regularly scheduled snapshot, just with a differen tname.	13:08
notting	ok. i remain concerned about final, though. yuck.	13:08
f13	jlaska: yeah, I think each day we'll probably trim a bit more off the blocker list, and get more toward "we'd actually slip the release for this"	13:08
* rdieter here (a little)		13:08
f13	notting: as do I.	13:08
f13	for those not in the "know"	13:08
poelcat	f13: how will we test out jigdo before GA?	13:08
f13	RH can't currently deliver any content over Internet2 to anybody	13:08
f13	which means our I2 mirrors get way behind	13:09
warren	Al Gore didn't invent it yet.	13:09
jwb	oh	13:09
f13	and all have ot use phx resources to get content, which is causing resource contention	13:09
* jds2001 sits in the back		13:09
f13	resources which are supposed to be shut off for releases due to not wanting to knock redhat.com off the internet again	13:09
f13	poelcat: I'm thinking of testing it by hand a bit with some custom mirrormanager urls that I'll ask mdomsch to create for me.	13:10
notting	do we have everything in place needed for preupgrade?	13:10
poelcat	f13: let me know if you want some help from a 'home user' :)	13:10
f13	notting: I have no idea on that front.  I think we're awefully late to be landing "features" such as that.	13:10
f13	poelcat: will do, likely the mirrormanager url will just reference rawhide	13:11
f13	Part of the final freeze is also the mass CVS branching	13:12
f13	I'm not entirely sure why the schedule has it on the 9th, I probably asked for it and promptly forgot why	13:12
f13	but abadger1999 needs some time to try and recover some optimizations on the pkgdb/fas side of things to make the branching go faster.	13:13
f13	it's still probbaly going to require a cvs outage, and a mail shutoff to keep from mailbombing everybody	13:13
abadger1999	also note, I think the pure cvs side of things has slowed down as well.	13:14
jwb	f13, maybe you were still thinking it was going to be a late tues freeze, so you wanted it on the 9th?	13:14
f13	I had a script at one point to do it, but that was pre fas2, and some other things have changed on pkgdb side, so I'll likely have to rewrite the script.	13:14
f13	jwb: could be.	13:14
notting	abadger1999: it's not like modules ever gets *smaller*	13:14
abadger1999	Right.	13:14
f13	abadger1999: curious, if the cvs slowdown is the ACL lookup + the "whom do I mail" lookup	13:14
f13	which I would think with an outage we could kill both of those	13:15
abadger1999	Esp. the whom do I mail would speed things up.	13:16
* abadger1999 writes a note to disable getnotifylist		13:16
warren	abadger1999: if we have a cvs outage, might we use that as an opportunity to finally rename cvsextras?	13:16
abadger1999	warren: You and f13 should work it out.  I can make it happen whenever everyone wants it.	13:17
warren	f13: any preference?	13:18
f13	warren: do you have a list of changes that would require?  Maybe an open infrastructure ticket?  noted which wiki pages need updating, etc..?	13:19
f13	I wouldn't be so keen on breaking cvs at the critical point in our release.  Much more comfortable doing it post-f9	13:19
warren	yeah, that might be a better idea	13:21
f13	I'm going to be flipping the fedora-release bit to make it look like F9, as well as turning off rawhide and on the "fedora" and "updates" repos.  We'll pull a mirrormanager trick again and just have those redirect to rawhide.	13:21
f13	(which should aide in testing out jigdo prior to release day)	13:22
warren	cool	13:22
warren	perfect	13:22
f13	and the rest of the time is just losing sleep over blocker lists.	13:22
f13	So, open floor on F9 Final issues.	13:22
notting	if we can't push it, we can't ship it.	13:23
f13	yep	13:23
f13	I'm probably going to harass people daily about this	13:23
notting	for F7 EOL, do we want to pick a date now, or wait until we're a little more clear on the panic/don't panic state of the blocker list?	13:24
f13	I'd say panic/don't panic.	13:25
f13	wait until we have a real RC	13:25
warren	Do we consider the upstart fails to shutdown, upstart causing always/frequent unclean unmount issues, possibly related runlevel changes do nothing... blockers?	13:25
notting	warren: the hell?	13:25
f13	warren: have you been able to find anybody else who sees this?	13:26
notting	please elaborate on your first and second comments with bug numbers	13:26
warren	really nobody else is seeing this? wow.	13:26
poelcat	related to that F7 EOL and the recent ______ on f-dev-list about those darn BugZappers	13:26
poelcat	are there any compelling reasons to keep EOL bugs open?	13:27
poelcat	someone shut me down if this is too much of a tangent for this meeting :)	13:27
f13	poelcat: well, the answer to that question is always "yes", but the real question is 'compelling enough to put up with the cruft' and that I think is no.	13:27
notting	poelcat: only on an individual reporter/maintainer's opinion on specific bugs	13:27
warren	https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=438444 switching to runlevel 1 does nothing https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=439699 you see nothing during shutdown (and sometimes it fails to shutdown)  https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=438449 killall race (might possibly related)	13:27
buggbot	Bug 438444: high, low, ---, Casey Dahlin, NEW , upstart - 'telinit 1' is not doing anything even close to advertised	13:27
buggbot	Bug 439699: low, low, ---, Casey Dahlin, NEW , No shutdown msgs displayed	13:27
buggbot	Bug 438449: low, low, ---, Casey Dahlin, NEW , /etc/rc.d/init.d/killall is racing with other "stops"	13:27
warren	I've personally NEVER seen my filesystem not replay journal since we've switched to upstart	13:27
notting	poelcat: does the bugzappers/triage stuff have an ability to only prod bugs once?	13:27
notting	did you file a bug?	13:28
poelcat	notting: sortof... we've got that c00l whiteboard tag ;-)	13:28
warren	well, been relying on the existing bugs.	13:28
notting	warren: none of those bugs have anything to do with journal replay	13:28
warren	notting: if it fails to cleanly shutdown it might?	13:29
notting	warren: presumably you'd notice that , considering you'd have to hit the power key, etc.	13:29
warren	notting: it is inconsistent, but sometimes it powers off very quickly after I hit Shutdown	13:30
poelcat	notting: so you're saying some way for a developmer to tag a bug as "don't auto close me" ?	13:30
warren	sometimes I do have to hold down the power button because X died, I haven no login getty's, and it is just stuck	13:30
notting	poelcat: i mean, once the triage system flags needinfo/whatever, i think it shouldn't try and do it *again* the next time it's chugging through rawhide	13:30
jds2001	well rawhide will be re-based to F9	13:31
poelcat	notting: well it shouldn't because the next action would be to ignore it or CLOSE if still needinfo	13:31
notting	poelcat: and if it's moved to 'devel' again...?	13:32
warren	in rare occasions I do actually see stuff shutting down	13:32
poelcat	notting: then it stays in 'rawhide' until the next GA when it gets rebased to the GA version	13:32
jds2001	it'll get put in the frying pan for the next cycle i think.	13:32
jds2001	poelcat: +1	13:32
notting	poelcat: right. that's what i mean about only frobbing the bug once	13:32
jds2001	hmm, is there a compelling reason not to every 6 months?	13:33
notting	not sure. i suppose we can see how it plays out	13:33
notting	i suppose my bigger triage concern is 'only one message per bug plz' :)	13:34
f13	seems like we're drifting here.	13:34
jds2001	yeah, sorry bout that :(	13:34
-!- f13 changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora Release Engineering - Open Floor		13:34
notting	f13: apologies.	13:34
notting	lmacken: bodhi need any prep for f9?	13:36
lmacken	notting: I don't believe so	13:37
lmacken	when do we want to start queueing up updates ?	13:37
f13	our sync scripts probably need updates	13:37
lmacken	I can create the F9 release in bodhi at any time, and keep it locked	13:37
f13	lets wait until we've branched	13:38
poelcat	f13: similar question for bug triage... when should we rebase rawhide-->f9 ?	13:38
poelcat	or should I ask this somewhere else?	13:39
f13	poelcat: probably elsewhere, but I'd say after we start shipping F10 content in rawhide.	13:40
f13	which would be after F9 goes gold.	13:40
poelcat	f13: okay thanks	13:42
f13	if there's nothing else, I'd like to wrap up and get back to work.	13:43
warren	nod	13:44
* warren looking into upstart issues...		13:44
f13	thanks all!	13:45

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