[Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:04:57] #startmeeting - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23 [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:04:58] Meeting started Tue Jun 23 16:04:54 2009 UTC. The chair is rdieter. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:04:58] Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot , Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:04:58] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to " (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:05:24] who's present today? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:05:31] Present. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:05:49] * SMParrish_ here [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:05:54] Kevin_Kofler, gratulaion! [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:06:13] * jreznik is here [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:06:24] * ltinkl present [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:06:24] * than is here [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:06:44] than: here afterall ? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:06:56] no, that is not than [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:06:58] ^^ [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:07:01] i'm just half here [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:07:04] Part arxs has left this channel. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:07:33] First, off, congratulations to Kevin_Kofler for being elected to FESCo [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:07:38] Join Matias_Arg has joined this channel (n=root@host84.190-136-135.telecom.net.ar). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:07:45] aye, congrats [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:07:47] congrat! [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:07:53] gratz from me as well Kevin [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:08:04] #info Kevin_Kofler elected to FESCo, any issues to bring up in the FESCo meeting? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:08:25] I'll skip forward to the related item in the agenda. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:09:00] #topic Kevin_Kofler elected to FESCo, any issues to bring up in the FESCo meeting? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:09:01] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "Kevin_Kofler elected to FESCo, any issues to bring up in the FESCo meeting? (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:09:01] there. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:09:29] FYI, the FESCo meeting is on Friday, so you have 3 days to think of stuff. :-) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:10:14] I'd like to prepare another feature page for F12 and KDE 4.3, but there's lot of time before it reach FESCo meeting [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:10:28] Don't worry, there will be more meetings. :-) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:10:32] Join che has joined this channel (n=che@redhat/che). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:10:35] :) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:11:18] Quit pwbarnes has left this server (Remote closed the connection). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:11:21] In any case, from the election results, it like quite some people are fed up with the GNOME tyranny. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:11:51] Join J5 has joined this channel (n=quintice@c-65-96-175-112.hsd1.ma.comcast.net). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:11:53] are the exact results out already? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:12:13] now now, please focus on bringing people together, working together, collaboration. that kind of talk is a wee bit divisive [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:12:15] Kevin_Kofler: not to jump in, but I think you've got your head up you ass with that statement. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:12:23] Yes, check fedora-announce [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:12:43] Quit iarlyy has left this server (Ping timeout: 180 seconds). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:12:45] Full results: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-announce-list/2009-June/msg00015.html [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:12:50] Quit rishi has left this server ("Ex-Chat"). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:13:58] bpepple: that's another way to put it. point taken. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:14:09] I got 48% of the achievable score, or the equivalent of 148.09 people voting full points (which also means at least 149 people gave me a non-zero score). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:14:35] Join pwbarnes has joined this channel (n=pwbarnes@fedora/nman64). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:14:37] rdieter: sorry to butt in, but I hate that see kind of KDe/GNOME sentiment. gets my blood boiling. ;) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:14:46] anyway, back to work, [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:14:46] bpepple: +1! [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:15:25] it's chance for us to be more involved in fedora development [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:15:25] next topic... [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:15:51] #topic RPM Macros for packaging, http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/PackagingCleanup#Macros [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:15:51] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "RPM Macros for packaging, http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/PackagingCleanup#Macros (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:16:22] initially, seems a bit over the top, macro'izing everything and the kitchen sink, but I think there's value to be had in there somewhere. :) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:16:41] I think we should have macros for the common directories. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:17:05] Especially because they might in principle change (though it's unlikely they will, due to backwards compatibility concerns). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:17:23] The list at the link comes from MathStuf. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:17:43] I'm torn, yeah. Now that things have stabilized, part of me wants to go the other direction, and try to minimize kde-specific macros. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:17:55] Quit drago01 has left this server (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:18:18] anyway, how about we through this at the ml's, for further discussion, and see where it goes. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:18:40] For the KDE 3 mimelnk dir: "KDE3; why do KDE4 apps still use this" - I guess for those remaining kdelibs3 apps. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:18:52] Quit oshan has left this server (Connection timed out). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:18:58] Yes, that's kde3 only [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:19:02] having those macros in place is handy, alto it means a lot of work for us to clean up the .spec files [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:19:06] But I don't think we have kdelibs3 file managers anymore now that Krusader is KDE 4. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:19:30] ltinkl: that's a concern too. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:19:57] but I guess it's worth the effort in the end [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:20:21] Join oshan has joined this channel (n=DarkM@124.43.62.18). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:20:54] Part mcepl has left this channel. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:21:15] I'll ask MathStuf to take it to the lists then, agreed? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:21:19] Quit Kaboon has left this server (Success). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:21:59] Yes. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:22:00] ok [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:22:00] * ltinkl brb [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:22:29] #action MathStuf to take http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/PackagingCleanup#Macros to mailing lists for further discussion [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:23:00] #topic critical path packages - does it affect us? should it? how? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:23:00] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "critical path packages - does it affect us? should it? how? (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:23:12] fyi, http://skvidal.wordpress.com/2009/06/22/critical-path-packages/ [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:23:38] I've put this up after noticing KDE packages are notoriously absent from his list. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:23:45] being at the FAD that came up with that idea, I'm naturally ok with it. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:23:50] So I wonder what our position on this should be. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:24:10] the point is, these are pkg's that have higher scrutiny release, qa, testing -wise. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:24:12] it should be great for lot of low level packages to avoid totally breakage like dbus issue [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:24:40] So, from a selfish point of view, not being on that list means less work. :) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:24:41] While I don't think we need more bureucracy hindering our updates, as history has shown it not to be needed, having GNOME on the list and KDE not means we're once against second-class citizens. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:24:48] So I have mixed feelings about this. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:25:04] well, Gnome packages shouldn't be part of that list imo [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:25:05] Part oshan has left this channel. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:25:05] but I dont think we want kde on the list [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:25:37] we have lot of eyes on updates-testing [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:25:38] well, one of the "use case" items as part of the critical path was "login", "do updates" [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:25:49] The rationale for including a GUI is that if the GUI is broken, end users are really stuck. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:26:13] It's not just that they don't necessarily know how to use the terminal, it's that they don't even know how to get to runlevel 3. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:26:38] but we really want KDE SIG member in that group... so he can stop updates which are wounding us [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:26:54] jreznik: +1 [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:27:22] currenty, the signoff group includes releng and qa. I'm in releng, if that makes anyone feel better. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:27:49] I think some work is really needed on GRUB usability. Our proprietary competition has ways to get to a command prompt or a "repair console" depending on the version, Fedora could easily offer that (it's what runlevel 3 is for). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:28:05] But that's outside of our (KDE SIG's) scope. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:29:31] A related topic is that we could really use a QA (as in testing - triaging is already covered by SMParrish_) volunteer. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:29:43] Join spoleeba has joined this channel (n=one@fedora/Jef). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:29:52] Right now, testing is done either by developers or by users who just step in to test something once. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:29:58] We don't have dedicated testers. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:30:31] Quit che has left this server (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:30:48] Join che has joined this channel (n=che@redhat/che). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:31:16] good idea. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:32:19] #help volunteers to help qa kde-related items [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:32:51] but first we need to set what we want to test [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:33:06] list of MUST be checked etc... [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:34:17] any volunteers to start on such a checklist of qa items? It can be a work-in-progress of course. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:34:31] Quit valente has left this server ("Leaving."). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:35:10] test plan would be nice for feature page test plan either [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:35:23] Join Kaboon has joined this channel (n=eelko@cc410553-a.assen1.dr.home.nl). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:35:41] Can we really come up with a systematic plan to test the entire KDE desktop? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:35:45] I don't think it's possible. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:36:02] that's a huge and long term task indeed [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:36:03] Basic QA is just "try to use the desktop and report any breakage you notice". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:36:04] It doesn't have to be exhaustive initially (or ever) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:36:31] but at least targetting some common use-cases would be a good start [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:36:43] Quit adamw has left this server (No route to host). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:36:50] Kevin_Kofler: but there should be something like test this, this and this as these are crucial parts of desktop [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:36:59] And usually there'll be something specific to test for the update (e.g. "does WPA in kde-plasma-nm work?" for a kde-plasma-nm update, "do Python plasmoids work without python-devel installed?" for my recent kdebindings fix etc.). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:37:04] Join miumiento has joined this channel (n=miumient@81-208-114-142.ip.fastwebnet.it). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:37:18] Quit miumiento has left this server (Client Quit). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:37:34] Quit azneita has left this server ("Leaving"). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:38:09] right, stuff fixed by updates, can include tests/checks for regressions [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:38:53] it'll be a (long) journey, with no real final destination. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:39:15] alright, I'll bite this one, and come up with some initial ideas. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:39:36] #topic sharing brand with upstream [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:39:37] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "sharing brand with upstream (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:39:42] jreznik: any news/progress? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:40:28] rdieter: I talked to pinheiro [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:40:35] Quit abadger1999 has left this server (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:40:53] and sent some mails to fedora-kde/design list [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:41:04] mostly it's about sharing [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:41:08] not replacing fedora brand [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:41:18] but I'm skeptic about schedules... :( [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:41:27] So far, the only feedback we got from the Fedora Design Team was from Máirín Duffy and it was negative. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:41:49] Kevin_Kofler: and from Nicu and it was mostly negative [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:42:04] I asked pinheiro to contact them directly [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:42:07] I haven't seen that one, I guess he only sent it to the design list, not the KDE one. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:42:19] Kevin_Kofler: it's possible, check design list [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:42:24] Part mpreston has left this channel. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:42:24] I think the negatively is mostly in the form of not knowing exactly what the process will be yet [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:42:38] indeed [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:42:49] Join adamw has joined this channel (n=AdamW@gibsonfandj.plus.com). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:43:07] it'll be a learning process for everyone involved, but I (still) strongly believe it will be a worthwhile one [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:43:08] Máirín's objections are basically 2: 1. they're worried about schedule pressure and 2. she doesn't like the idea of KDE-specific themes. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:43:17] everyone switch to defence mode when you want more work from him :D [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:43:19] Join openpercept has joined this channel (n=openperc@fedora/openpercept). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:43:48] The schedule issue is an open point of contention and it seems communication is also lacking. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:43:52] 2. is that really an issue? The artwork team hasn't really helped make any kde themes to date, why is this any different? am I missing something? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:43:56] with new proposed schedules by martin sourada it seems more possible [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:44:25] It seems the Design Team's position is that the schedules are fine, only F11 was particularly late, but the lateness in F7 to F10 was normal. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:44:50] On the other hand, we basically agreed in past meetings that we need their output much earlier. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:44:50] interesting. really? normal? ouchie. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:45:23] we're are mostly on our own so any help from upstream is great for us I think [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:45:35] well, ok, once we have a Release name, and some initial theming ideas, I assume this process can start to move forward. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:45:39] I'd like to try it even it means more work [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:45:46] jreznik: +1 [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:46:17] opensuse and kubuntu are joining too [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:46:29] #action jreznik to continue as liason between fedora-art team and upsream kde art folks in "sharing branding" [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:46:58] #topic Fedora 12 KDE 4.3 feature page [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:46:58] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "Fedora 12 KDE 4.3 feature page (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:47:23] ok, again for me - than asked me to prepare feature page [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:47:27] totally +1 for this, helps the marketing/qa machine, if nothing else. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:47:38] I guess jreznik with my help will create this page [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:47:45] thanks guys [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:47:49] jreznik: About the artwork stuff: Sure that offloading work to upstream could in principle mean less work for us, but I'm not convinced that it will really mean that. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:48:00] what we want to market as great feature for 4.3/12? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:48:09] I think it just means we'll have some stale KDE 4.3 look elements in our 4.4 and 4.5 updates. :-( [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:48:13] 2 items worth mentioning: polkit-1 and Solid/DeviceKit [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:49:04] About the 4.3 feature page: my main issue with those feature pages is that we advertise something as a "new feature" in F12 when it'll have been out as an F11 update for months already. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:49:41] Quit comphappy has left this server ("Quit"). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:49:45] Kevin_Kofler: true in part, but it's still good for marketting, esp for the "new" items ltinkl mentioned [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:49:46] ltinkl: The thing is, mentioning items with nobody working on implementing them is not of much use. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:49:58] ha :) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:50:00] Kevin_Kofler: *we* are (well, ltinkl and jreznik ) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:50:10] Join oshan has joined this channel (n=DarkM@124.43.51.31). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:50:19] Is anybody working on DeviceKit support in Solid yet? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:50:26] I already have a working Solid-DeviceKit [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:50:41] http://websvn.kde.org/branches/work/solid-devicekit/ [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:50:56] and jreznik committed the polkit-1-qt port [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:50:57] I'm not sure it's time to mention polkit-qt-1... it's really first tryout [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:51:13] http://websvn.kde.org/branches/work/polkit-qt-1/ [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:51:37] so we should really advertise something we have worked hard on :) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:51:42] Join cassmodiah has joined this channel (n=cass@fedora/cassmodiah). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:52:00] Quit neverho0d has left this server (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:52:38] I assume this work will be targetted for kde-4.4 ? (other?) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:52:47] yup, that's the plan [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:52:57] upstream kde-4.4 that is, we'll want to include/use it asap of course [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:04] But we can backport it, we'll basically have to backport the PolicyKit stuff. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:18] once KDE 4.3 has been released, the trunk opens for 4.4 development and we merge our work branches back [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:34] coolness. anything else feature-page related? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:34] yup and we, as in Fedora-KDE, can backport it [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:35] I hope it's stuff for 4.4 [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:38] How well does Solid-DeviceKit work? And what kind of devices does it support? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:42] Quit J5 has left this server (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:53:54] Long term, only the daemons for disks and power management are here to stay. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:54:01] Kevin_Kofler: works pretty fine, but supports only Disks and PowerManagement so far [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:54:04] We're supposed to use libudev for tasks like device enumeration. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:54:32] Kevin_Kofler: not really, details after the meeting, long story :) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:54:42] The main (not -disks nor -power) DeviceKit daemon is deprecated (at least according to blog posts I found). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:54:48] Quit Gaaruto has left this server (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:55:19] So if we design for that one, we'll be stuck again. :-( [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:55:29] But we can discuss this in #fedora-kde. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:55:47] yup [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:55:57] I think that's it for the agenda (unless I missed something). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:56:04] #topic open discussion [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:56:04] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:56:18] gcds? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:56:29] anyone going to gran canaria? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:56:52] http://www.grancanariadesktopsummit.org [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:56:54] sadly, not I this time. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:57:26] rdieter: still doing FUDCon Berlin? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:57:27] Join kital has joined this channel (n=Joerg_Si@fedora/kital). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:57:32] something what can I do for us there? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:57:34] secondary issue, for any ev'er who *is* going, interesting is proxy'ing for me? [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:57:37] jreznik is going, so direct any questions/queries towards KDE developers to him :) [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:57:42] SMParrish_: no [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:57:46] Join mdomsch has joined this channel (n=Matt_Dom@cpe-70-124-62-55.austin.res.rr.com). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [18:59:44] Join J5 has joined this channel (n=quintice@c-65-96-175-112.hsd1.ma.comcast.net). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:03] #topic gran caria summit [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:04] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "gran caria summit (Meeting topic: - KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2009-06-23)". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:09] #link http://www.grancanariadesktopsummit.org [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:29] looks like time is out for today, thanks all [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:44] #endmeeting [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:45] Topic fedbot sets the channel topic to "Channel is used by various Fedora groups and committees for their regular meetings | Note that meetings often get logged | For questions about using Fedora please ask in #fedora | See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting_channel for meeting schedule". [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:45] Meeting ended Tue Jun 23 17:00:41 2009 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:45] Minutes: http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-23-16.04.html [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:45] Log: http://www.scrye.com/~kevin/fedora/fedora-meeting/2009/fedora-meeting.2009-06-23-16.04.log.html [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:00:47] Join drago01 has joined this channel (n=linux@chello062178124130.3.13.univie.teleweb.at). [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:01:44] the bot did an ok job, neat. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:01:59] Well, there's less content than would be in a manual summary. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:02:28] when we all get more used to the bot commands, it'll be a little better too [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:02:29] Having to explicitly put things to protocol while discussion is underway is not ideal. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:02:44] Kevin_Kofler: I have to leave now but I can extend it manually... but tomorrow [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:02:48] so for now, I guess it can at least suppliment what we already do [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:02:50] could you please upload it [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:03:12] jreznik: The bot already uploaded it, see the links it posted. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:03:28] I still think it's much better to discuss first and summarize afterwards. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:03:56] Another issue is that typos end up right there and can't be fixed in the autogenerated stuff, unlike something on the wiki. [Tue Jun 23 2009] [19:04:24] For example, the summit is called "gran caria" instead of "Gran Canaria". A huge dental bacterium? ^^