[2008-01-03 17:16] *** rdieter nastavil téma kanálu na "KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2008-01-03 -- KDE4 livecd https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2007-December/msg00494.html".
[2008-01-03 17:16] <rdieter> topic 1: KDE4 livecd ( https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2007-December/msg00494.html )
[2008-01-03 17:16] <rdieter> svahl? wanna lead this one?
[2008-01-03 17:17] --> petreu has joined this channel (n=peter@fedora/Standby).
[2008-01-03 17:17] <svahl> sure
[2008-01-03 17:17] <Kevin_Kofler> Note also this reply: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2008-January/msg00003.html
[2008-01-03 17:17] <Kevin_Kofler> The archives are split at month boundaries irrespectively of threading. :-(
[2008-01-03 17:17] <svahl> it seems we have a lot of problems with the current state of kde4. some problems are related to kde itself, some to x11 and some to gtk
[2008-01-03 17:18] <rdieter> do we have a local (fedora) bz opened for the gtk applet's crasher issue?
[2008-01-03 17:18] <rdieter> if not, we should open one for tracking purposes.
[2008-01-03 17:18] <ltinkl> note that kde4 is still under (sometimes heavy) development, despite the freeze
[2008-01-03 17:18] <svahl> i don't know such one
[2008-01-03 17:19] <svahl> for the kde4 bugs we should search for bugs at bugs.kde.org (I haven't had the time to do this, yet)
[2008-01-03 17:19] <ljuwaidah> I'm here!
[2008-01-03 17:19] <Kevin_Kofler> We should definitely build another live CD once we have 4.0.0 in.
[2008-01-03 17:20] <ltinkl> idd
[2008-01-03 17:20] <svahl> esp this ones: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2007-December/msg00524.html
[2008-01-03 17:20] <svahl> Kevin_Kofler: sure. But we should try to get the intel driver problem (composite/kwin) fixed before that
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[2008-01-03 17:21] <Kevin_Kofler> The vesa driver problem worries me just as much.
[2008-01-03 17:21] <Kevin_Kofler> It breaks QEMU and possibly other VMs too.
[2008-01-03 17:22] <Kevin_Kofler> And it breaks falling back (xdriver=vesa) for machines with a broken X driver (like my old laptop or like the Intel machines with driver problems).
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[2008-01-03 17:23] <svahl> do you know a bug for that?
[2008-01-03 17:24] <Kevin_Kofler> No. Let me look, and if there isn't any, file one.
[2008-01-03 17:24] <rdieter> fwiw, looks like kde-4.0 will ship with compositing disabled by default.
[2008-01-03 17:24] <rdieter> imo, the right choice (else we probably would've patched, kde-settings'd it to that anyway).
[2008-01-03 17:24] <Kevin_Kofler> OK, that'll downgrade the severity of the Intel problems from "showstopper" to "very annoying".
[2008-01-03 17:25] <svahl> and we should also file a bug for the intel driver (I cannot reproduce this because i don't have an intel card)
[2008-01-03 17:25] <rdieter> svahl: I do, and will file if problems persist after kde-4.0 live images are available.
[2008-01-03 17:25] <svahl> rdieter: thx
[2008-01-03 17:26] <Kevin_Kofler> The last xorg-x11-drv-vesa bug report is 398991, that's very old, no bug about the current problem. I'll file one.
[2008-01-03 17:26] <rdieter> likewise, if vesa-related problems persist after kde-4.0, we can nag there too. :)
[2008-01-03 17:28] <svahl> kde4 stable is scheduled for 2008-01-11. When we get it into rawhide I'll build new live images (or better: try to get official ones)
[2008-01-03 17:28] <Kevin_Kofler> It's scheduled to be tagged tomorrow.
[2008-01-03 17:28] <Kevin_Kofler> So likely we'll have tarballs before Jan 11.
[2008-01-03 17:29] <rdieter> fyi (and offtopic, but), due to familty plans/schedule changes, I (most likely) won't be able to attend the kde 4.0 release party @ google.  bummer.
[2008-01-03 17:30] <svahl> I'll try to collect all bug reports from the thread at fedora-test-list over the weekend
[2008-01-03 17:30] <Kevin_Kofler> OK, great.
[2008-01-03 17:30] <svahl> so we could see if they still occure in kde 4.0.0
[2008-01-03 17:30] <rdieter> anything else here?  move on?
[2008-01-03 17:30] <svahl> I'm done
[2008-01-03 17:30] <Kevin_Kofler> Let's move on.
[2008-01-03 17:32] <svahl> Kevin_Kofler: I've put kde-settings to the agenda because you've mentioned it here: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2007-December/msg00524.html
[2008-01-03 17:32] *** rdieter nastavil téma kanálu na "KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2008-01-03 -- kde-settings for kde 4".
[2008-01-03 17:32] <svahl> so that's maybe your topic
[2008-01-03 17:32] <Kevin_Kofler> Yes. Most application settings should be OK already, but settings for the desktop are still at upstream defaults and may need discussion.
[2008-01-03 17:33] <Kevin_Kofler> 1. Upstream is going to default to not showing desktop icons, I think we should really default to showing them instead.
[2008-01-03 17:33] <Kevin_Kofler> 2. Do we want to default to Kickoff or simple menu?
[2008-01-03 17:33] <ltinkl> ad 1) let's decide once we see how it performs
[2008-01-03 17:33] <ltinkl> ad 2) i'm inclined to kickoff
[2008-01-03 17:34] <rdieter> ltinkl: +1 (what you said)
[2008-01-03 17:34] <ltinkl> but again, let's talk about the defaults once the final 4.0 is out IMHO
[2008-01-03 17:35] <ltinkl> most of the things you can see now in our (fedora) cvs have changed meanwhile in KDE SVN
[2008-01-03 17:35] <Kevin_Kofler> True, right now we don't even know how displaying desktop icons and the simple menu work, because those features were not in 3.97.0 at all.
[2008-01-03 17:35] <ltinkl> exactly
[2008-01-03 17:37] <-- ageso has left this server (Remote closed the connection).
[2008-01-03 17:37] <svahl> but we have to do this fast. alpha freeze is scheduled for 2008-01-15
[2008-01-03 17:37] <Kevin_Kofler> We can change settings after the alpha.
[2008-01-03 17:37] <rdieter> yep, no worries.
[2008-01-03 17:37] <Kevin_Kofler> I'd say let's put this on the agenda again once we have 4.0.
[2008-01-03 17:37] <rdieter> +1
[2008-01-03 17:37] <Kevin_Kofler> Now let's move on.
[2008-01-03 17:38] <svahl> k
[2008-01-03 17:38] *** rdieter nastavil téma kanálu na "KDE SIG Meeting -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2008-01-03 -- development progress: the road to kde4".
[2008-01-03 17:38] <rdieter> on the road a again...
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[2008-01-03 17:39] <rdieter> oops, got that wrong, anyway, not sure what else to add here, Kevin, maybe mention the newly packaged extragear bits?
[2008-01-03 17:40] <rdieter> fyi, http://frinring.wordpress.com/2008/01/03/adding-tools-to-okteta/
[2008-01-03 17:41] <Kevin_Kofler> I packaged Okteta: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=427185
[2008-01-03 17:41] <buggbot> Bug 427185: medium, medium, ---, Nobody's working on this, feel free to take it, NEW , Review Request: okteta - Binary editor
[2008-01-03 17:41] <Kevin_Kofler> It's still in playground, but it's already working.
[2008-01-03 17:41] <ltinkl> it's supposed to replace khexedit right?
[2008-01-03 17:41] <Kevin_Kofler> And there's no khexedit in kdeutils anymore in 4.0.0.
[2008-01-03 17:41] <Kevin_Kofler> KHexEdit was unmaintained and not fully ported to KDE 4.0.
[2008-01-03 17:41] <Kevin_Kofler> Okteta is the replacement.
[2008-01-03 17:42] <rdieter> cool, it'll be nice to sprinkle in a few more kde4 apps, cause at the moment, outside of the core kde4 packages/desktop, there's not much else kde4-wise in fedora (yet).
[2008-01-03 17:43] <rdieter> I'm sure that will change/progress after kde4 is actually released.
[2008-01-03 17:43] <Kevin_Kofler> Okteta will probably be in late alpha or early beta stage at F9 release, but that's related to feature completeness, not bugginess.
[2008-01-03 17:44] <Kevin_Kofler> I tested the current build on F8 and it appears to be basically usable.
[2008-01-03 17:44] <Kevin_Kofler> Missing undo sucks, of course, hopefully that'll be implemented soon.
[2008-01-03 17:44] <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: thanks
[2008-01-03 17:44] <rdieter> anything else kde4-wise to mention today?
[2008-01-03 17:44] <Kevin_Kofler> Yes.
[2008-01-03 17:45] <ltinkl> just wanted to mention the state of kde translations, do the tarballs build at least finally?
[2008-01-03 17:45] <Kevin_Kofler> I applied upstream patches to our kdemultimedia so kio_audiocd works.
[2008-01-03 17:45] <rdieter> ltinkl: from what I hear, upstream svn is fixed, existing tarballs are busted.
[2008-01-03 17:45] <ltinkl> Kevin_Kofler: saw the commits in KDE svn, nice work1
[2008-01-03 17:45] <Kevin_Kofler> The cdparanoia one is already in SVN for 4.0, the FLAC one is from the kde-multimedia mailing list.
[2008-01-03 17:46] <Kevin_Kofler> What commits in upstream SVN?
[2008-01-03 17:46] <ltinkl> ye
[2008-01-03 17:47] <Kevin_Kofler> One thing I want to talk about is the remaining extragear stuff from my wishlist.
[2008-01-03 17:47] <Kevin_Kofler> svahl: Are you still working on kaudiocreator?
[2008-01-03 17:48] <Kevin_Kofler> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/KDE4Status#head-928cc2a2c2429f8f6a343c1a88c6588adc416992
[2008-01-03 17:48] <svahl> I haven't had the time to do so. maybe next week
[2008-01-03 17:48] <-- fabian_a has left this server (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
[2008-01-03 17:49] <Kevin_Kofler> And I believe the other ones are still up for grabs?
[2008-01-03 17:49] <Kevin_Kofler> I'll probably package kiconedit and kcoloredit next, at least those have tarballs to work from.
[2008-01-03 17:50] <svahl> I don't know that someone is working on one of them
[2008-01-03 17:50] <ltinkl> I think it's mostly konq-plugins and kaudiocreator that should be of interest to us
[2008-01-03 17:51] <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: suggestion: add those wishlist items to either the fedora or kde-specific package wishlists on the wiki, so more folks will see it, and have a chance to help package/contribute.
[2008-01-03 17:51] <Kevin_Kofler> ltinkl: So can you submit konq-plugins for review? :-)
[2008-01-03 17:51] <ltinkl> ok
[2008-01-03 17:52] <Kevin_Kofler> svahl will take care of kaudiocreator.
[2008-01-03 17:53] <rdieter> last thing I wanted to mention today was xsettings-kde, see also https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-devel-list/2007-December/msg01822.html
[2008-01-03 17:53] <rdieter> anyone else try it out yet?
[2008-01-03 17:54] <rdieter> I've been giving it a light workout on my f7 box @ work.
[2008-01-03 17:54] <Kevin_Kofler> Let me advertise my review requests again:
[2008-01-03 17:54] <Kevin_Kofler> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=425872
[2008-01-03 17:54] <buggbot> Bug 425872: medium, medium, ---, Nobody's working on this, feel free to take it, NEW , Review Request: kde4-decoration-native-quarticurve-kwin - Unofficial port of the Bluecurve KWin decoration to KDE 4
[2008-01-03 17:54] <Kevin_Kofler> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=427185
[2008-01-03 17:55] <buggbot> Bug 427185: medium, medium, ---, Nobody's working on this, feel free to take it, NEW , Review Request: okteta - Binary editor
[2008-01-03 17:55] <Kevin_Kofler> rdieter: I haven't tried it yet. Is this targeted for F7/F8 updates? F9?
[2008-01-03 17:56] <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: can target everywhere
[2008-01-03 17:56] <Kevin_Kofler> And did this get any testing with KDE 4 yet?
[2008-01-03 17:56] <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: hrm, good point, only tested on kde3 atm.
[2008-01-03 17:57] <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: I'll have to look closer at the code to see exactly how it bridges kde settings and xsettings.
[2008-01-03 17:57] <rdieter> otherwise, we're running short on time, any parting words/thoughts?
[2008-01-03 17:58] <Kevin_Kofler> Interestingly the source code mentions a "Copyright (c) 2001 Red Hat, Inc." - looks like this used to be worked on at RH once upon a time.
[2008-01-03 17:58] <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: it was based on a reference xsettings deamon implementation from rh, yes.
[2008-01-03 17:59] <Kevin_Kofler> I'm also not sure setting things like Net/ThemeName from KDE settings makes any sense.
[2008-01-03 17:59] <Kevin_Kofler> Most KDE themes are not GTK+ themes.
[2008-01-03 18:00] <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: yeah, we'll have to review it, make changes where/if it makes sense.
[2008-01-03 18:01] <rdieter> and I really, *really* want that pushed upstream (to kde) when/if possible.
[2008-01-03 18:01] <Kevin_Kofler> +1
[2008-01-03 18:01] <Kevin_Kofler> Looks like we're out of time.
[2008-01-03 18:02] *** rdieter nastavil téma kanálu na "Channel is used by various Fedora groups and committees for their regular meetings | Note that meetings often get logged | For questions about using Fedora please ask in #fedora | See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/FedoraMeetingChannel for meeting schedule".
[2008-01-03 18:02] <rdieter> KDE SIG meeting end, thanks all