NewsProject/Meetings/2009-01-30

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Fedora News Project Meetings: 2009-01-30

Meeting Log


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* ctyler_ will be a few minutes late for FWN IRC meeting
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 pcalarco has changed the topic to: Fedora Weekly News meeting 13:00-14:00 UTC
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<pcalarco> greetings, Adam!
<abatkin> Hello
<_ush_> Good morning
<pcalarco> we'll wait a few minutes for everyone to arrive; Good morning!
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<pcalarco> we'll start in one minute by introducing ourselves with our Fedora wiki name
<nicubunu> hello everybody
<pcalarco> Greetings, Nicu!
 okay, let's do a role call; please introduce yourself with your Fedora username
 PascalCalarco
<_ush_> OisinFeeley
<nicubunu> NicuBuculei
<abatkin> Abatkin
<pcalarco> ctyler noted that he will be late a few minutes for the meeting; I think we can 
get started now thanks to everyone for joining; we have a lot of good topics to discuss, so 
we'll jump right in to the agenda
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<pcalarco> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:Fedora_News_2009-01-30
 first item we have is finding new writers for some of the dormant beats
 Ambassadors, Marketing, and Security Week are the most important
<_ush_> I guess we need to contact the people whose beats have not appeared for months and give 
them the chance to restart them if they want to.
<pcalarco> yes
<nicubunu> and then rase a call for writers on the respective lists?
<pcalarco> I will take the action item to contact the Ambassador contact and follow up on that 
list; could I have other volunteers?
<_ush_> I'm presuming it is best if someone active in a particular list does outreach?
<pcalarco> ideally
 I can also do marketing
<_ush_> If no one else steps up I'll do Security Week.  It may be necessary to cast a wide net 
there.  I miss that column.
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<pcalarco> we could ask David Nalley if he knows someone suitable for the security liust, since 
he does sec updates
<_ush_> pcalarco: good idea
<pcalarco> ah great, Oisin, thanks
 could you get in touch with David?
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<_ush_> pcalarco: will do
<pcalarco> Greetings, Stickster!
 ok, next item; we have several formatting open issues
<stickster_afk> Hi pcalarco
<pcalarco> the first issue is Dale's suggestion for templates, such as he has used with <pkg>
 the first question I have is where are all of these documented?
<_ush_> I like what Dale is doing, but I have no idea how it fits in with general Docs policy 
for wiki
<pcalarco> +1
<_ush_> There's nothing in the style guide that I can find about pkg templates.
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<_ush_> And people being able to find/search content in wiki is most important thing probably
 So I would welcome guidance from knowledgeable docs people
<pcalarco> it has been useful though, so we could suggest these as revisions upstream, so to speak
 perhaps Oisin and I could take as an action item to investigate what is possible here and 
present these to the News Team?
<_ush_> pcalarco: sounds like what we need to do.  We may need to create a wiki scratch space, 
play around and show the results to the docs list and ask for feedback.
<pcalarco> very good.  Any other comments on this issue before moving on?
 ok.  The next issue is person references in stories.
 IanWeller suggested instead of camelcase references we use the User: references
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<abatkin> It's not always easy finding user pages, sometimes I can find one but not the other
<pcalarco> detailed discussion on this at: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User_talk:Dale
<nicubunu> this happened to me a couple of issues ago, used the name in camel case style of the 
person who wrote to the mailing list
<pcalarco> I often have to search the wiki as well
<nicubunu> but it wasn't the name he use for the wiki, so he edited my beat some days after we 
published FWN
<_ush_> pcalarco: I've done this occasionally but I don't like doing it. It's a lot more work 
than using CamelCase. I guess it depends on possible workflows: I use LaTeX/LyX -> (ascii export) 
-> Vim.  I use macros in Vim to autoformat CamelCase names in wiki markup and having to do the 
User: thing means I have to create a dictionary of every possible one
<_ush_> abatkin: +1
<pcalarco> this is coming as a strong suggestion from the Docs group, so I think we should try 
to be compliant with the MediaWiki standard, to the extent we can
<_ush_> pcalarco: so what possible tools can we use to ease the burden?
<pcalarco> perhaps we could search for usernames as appropriate, and where they don't exist, we 
could use camelcase?
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<pcalarco> project wide, it would be good if we could encourage people to move their wiki personal 
pages to the User:<user> space
<abatkin> That sounds reasonable to me (best effort, then fallback to whatever you can find)
<pcalarco> I don't know who is 'in charge' of that, if anyone is however
 that is perhaps the docs team, as I think about it
<_ush_> At risk of de-railing topic, what tools do people use to write their beats? I ask b/c I'm 
wondering if I'm making life hard for myself
<pcalarco> ush: I just write in the wiki itself, with copying/pasting in the browser
<abatkin> Ditto
<nicubunu> i do the same, write directly in the wiki
<_ush_> Interesting.
<pcalarco> so perhaps for name references, we can search for usernames and then fall back to camelcase 
where we don't find folks on the first try?  If this is acceptable, I will revise the FWN StyleGuide 
to this end 
<_ush_> +1
<pcalarco> ok, great.  Next topic is possibly a new header with logo for FWN, possibly sourced from 
the Art Team
<nicubunu> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/DesignService
<pcalarco> I think part of this question depends on what we decide to do or not do, with Fedora 
Magazine ah, thank you, Nicu
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<_ush_> pcalarco: we could also just give FWN an overhaul on the wiki as well possibly. But yes, if 
we get involved with FM then we definitely need it.
<pcalarco> so if we decide we want a snazzier graphic for FWN we can make a request with the Art Team 
for something appropriately engaging
 that is a great service
<_ush_> pcalarco: it sure is!
<nicubunu> also Ian Weller and Mo can help with styling the wiki page
<pcalarco> ush: yes, good point, we can have both wiki and FM
<_ush_> nicubunu: that would be great. What sort of load is on the Art Team?  Is there a better/worse 
time for us to get some attention?
<pcalarco> nicubunu: wonderful; are there some examples of where this has been done that you could 
suggest that we look at?
<nicubunu> the best is to place a request to the DesignService queue and ping the mailing list
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<nicubunu> there is no bad or good time, some of us will be busy but some other free at any time
* pcalarco nods
<nicubunu> i believe mizmo-out and ian worked on the current wiki layout, so they are "experts" in 
the matter
 but we have to define what is needed: only a banner or more
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<pcalarco> Okay, Oisin and I could follow up with IanWeller and start a conversation on what is 
possible
 let's discuss http/https references and then move on to discuss Fedora Magazine
* ctyler has connectivity issues, will have to read logs afterwards
<_ush_> This kind of plays into the request to the list from Thorsten Leemhuis a week or so ago.
 He felt that FWN was not as professional looking as e.g. OpenSuSE mag.
<pcalarco> ctyler: no problem, welcome :)
 yes
<_ush_> There were a couple of issue: 1) references appearing below each paragraph; 
2) lack of hyperlinking to references to save having to scroll to find each one
<pcalarco> consulting with IanWeller may result in a more slick look for FWN
<_ush_> Max Spevack has been experminenting with the ref tags in his last two columns
<pcalarco> yes, I suppose this is a MediaWiki convention as well?
<nicubunu> i understood we are using references so FWN can also be sent as plain text email
<_ush_> and I did a couple of tests last night and it looks as though we can easily do 
the references thing
 I checked the export to plaintext by cut and paste and it works nicely
 https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/OisinFeeley#Testing_references
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<_ush_> all you do is wrap the URL in open and close ref tags. Then at the end of the news 
item add a references place holder.
<pcalarco> ok, this seems like an obvious change then; this does look much cleaner
<_ush_> So, it seems as though our mediawiki instance has the cite module enabled.
 There's a warning in the documentation for that module that you can't mix this style and 
some other one, so we should check that out. I didn't grok it.  But I'd like to move to this 
way of doing things if there are no objections or obvious problems
<pcalarco> we can update the FWN StyleGuide with this as well, and send a summary note to 
fedora-news-list; then begin introducing the changes into this week's FWN?
<_ush_> pcalarco: +1.  I'll add this reference stuff to style guide
<pcalarco> ush: many thanks
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<pcalarco> ok, this leaves some good time for discussion of whether we want to try to get 
involved with Fedora Magazine, which was so impressive to me when I saw it
 and it offers one of our longer-term goals to provide RSS capability for FWN
<nicubunu> too bad we didn't get JonRob in this talk
<pcalarco> nicubunu: we can follow up with him if there is sufficient consensus that we 
want to help 
<_ush_> I like the idea of FM, but I'm worried about the lack of apparent manpower.  As 
things stand it makes it look as though we're dead. So, either we commit full blown with 
a reasonably idea of what it would take to make it run (e.g. extra commitments from several 
of us) or else we make sure that FWN is not conflated with FM.
 Currently FWN is producing content and FM is not.
<nicubunu> it looks like his magazine died after a few weeks... or is dormant
<pcalarco> one radical idea would be to stop producing FWN in the wiki and move it to FM
 that would seed it with some regular content
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<_ush_> pcalarco: like nicubunu mentioned I occasionally have people edit inaccuracies in 
the wiki.  I would not want to see that lost.
<abatkin> Is FM meant to put out "issues" periodically (weekly? monthly?) or continuously 
posting new things?
<_ush_> Is there some way we could export from MediaWiki to Wordpress?
<nicubunu> but this editing is not too late?
<_ush_> abatkin: if it's modeled after Redhat Magazine then they have rolling content updated 
as it comes in I think.
<nicubunu> AFAIK, the idea for FM was to put content *daily*
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<_ush_> nicubunu: in general yes, but at least the corrections are there for the record and 
I also learn from it :)
<pcalarco> perhaps start off with a weekly issue; daily is a high bar to start from
<_ush_> It seems like quite a few people read the archives of FWN, probably b/c they're busy 
and then catch up later
<nicubunu> each day another type of content
 like Monday FWN, Tuesday "package of the week" and so on
<pcalarco> if we could identify enough active subprojects, with people to regularly commit 
content, this would work well
<abatkin> I often see blog posts (or a series of posts) that could be featured more prominently 
as top-level articles
<_ush_> I loved JonRob's developer interviews and would like to see more.
<pcalarco> what are appropriate action items for this, at this point?  Certainly follow 
up with JonRob
<nicubunu> JonRob called for help and I believe he didn't get follow-up, this is why FM 
is dormant
<_ush_> pcalarco: it seems like we could help seeding like you say, but I don't want to 
move away from wiki
<pcalarco> how many of us have time to work on helping with FM?
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<pcalarco> ush: +1
<nicubunu> due to lack of other content, FM used my webcomic as one of its regular sources 
of content
<abatkin> pcalarco: I could chip in every once in a while
<pcalarco> nicu: I have always liked your comic and read it fairly regularly; I think this 
would be good to syndicate in there
<_ush_> I'd suggest: 1) investigate how to export from MediaWiki to e.g. wordpress or whatever 
is the CMS du jour supported by infrastrucure; 2) contact JonRob to ask what his plans are; 
3) take abatkin up on his offer now !
<pcalarco> ush: :) +1
<nicubunu> i don't want also to commit to anything else than "once in a while", i already 
have two things to work on a weekly basis (FWN and the webcomic)
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<pcalarco> okay, sounds good then,thank you all
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<pcalarco> I must go to a meeting at the top of the hour
<_ush_> I can probably help, but I want to see what the available tools mean in terms of 
commitment of work
 I've got to go soon too.  I'll shut up now
<pcalarco> ush: agreed
<nicubunu> another think which may work with FM
 we at the Art team were thinking about collecting photos - wallpaper photos
<pcalarco> thank you to everyone who came out to this meeting.  I will post the log to 
fedora-news-list and also the wiki, later this morning
<nicubunu> so if this get traction, maybe a wallpaper of the week
<pcalarco> +1
 okay, meeting is adjourned.  Many thanks everyone, and have a great weekend!