QA/Meetings/20090318

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Contents

Attendees

  • Jesse Keating (f13)
  • James Laska (jlaska)
  • Adam Williamson (adamw)
  • Will Woods (wwoods)
  • Jóhann Guðmundsson (viking_ice)

Previous meeting follow-up

Follow-up from last meeting http://wwoods.fedorapeople.org/fedora-qa/fedora-qa-20090311.log.html

  • [jlaska&adamw] mediawiki semantic* packaging
  • [adamw] - intel test day was a success, we're hoping to have an intel follow up later before f11's release, to test fixes for the issues identified at the first event
  • [jlaska] - DeviceKit test day was successful in identifying several key bugs, but the event did not have the level of participation we hoped for.

F-11-Beta - who/what/when/where/why?

  • Beta is scheduled for availability 03/24, which means it needs to begin pushing to mirrors on 03/20 (Fri)
  • A lot of concern around whether we have enough information to say that F-11-Beta is generally installable
    • f13 noted that if I don't get a golden tree in the form of tomorrow's rawhide, I think we slip.
    • f13 and jlaska expressed concern about the bugs that haven't yet been filed (due to blocker issues)
  • jlaska asked what information do you need to make a slip vs no slip recommendation?
    • f13 replied a what works, vs what doesn't work, vs what hasn't been tested
    • adamw offered assistance from the BugZappers team (iarly) in reviewing the 42 NEW bugs to identify which issues should be noted on the F11Beta blocker bug list
    • jlaska will send out a request for installation test results focused around autopart using existing Linux, autopart using free space, autopart using entire disk, all of those + encryption

Upcoming QA events

Open discussion

  • viking_ice noted the new SysRq documentation page - QA/Sysrq
  • viking_ice noted there is a enhancement request open in fedora-infrastructure (see https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1245) to create/host some type of RSS aggregator for Fedora announcements.
  • viking_ice asked whether maintainers/developers should introduce themselves when replying on fedora-test-list@
    • adamw cautioned that this might be a difficult task (akin to herding cats)

Action items

  • [jlaska+adamw] mediawiki semantic update (packaging and hosting)
  • [adamw] schedule radeon test day
  • [adamw] review OPEN installer bugs and escalate appropriate issues to F11Beta blocker list
  • [jlaska] email fedora-test-list@ with call for testing of rawhide installs
    • will review test results at end of day Thursday for a slip decision
  • [jlaska] build XFCE live images and request fedorapeople hosting from jeremy
  • [jlaska] find Beta Release notes wiki page? (thanks to frields ... Fedora_11_Beta_release_notes)

Next QA meeting

No time was left to discuss a new time for next weeks meeting. We will continue with 17:00 UTC unless otherwise noted on fedora-test-list.

The next meeting will be held on 2009-03-25 17:00 UTC (1pm EDT).

IRC Transcript

--- | jlaska has changed the topic to: Fedora QA meeting (https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2009-March/msg00965.html) | init Mar 18 12:00
jlaska | Let's wait a few for folks to adjust to the changed meeting time Mar 18 12:01
--- | stickster_afk is now known as stickster Mar 18 12:01
jlaska | adamw: f13: wwoods (not expected today): viking_ice Mar 18 12:02
viking_ice | * Mar 18 12:02
jlaska | anyone I missed, please raise your hands :) Mar 18 12:02
jlaska | viking_ice: hello Mar 18 12:03
* | f13 Mar 18 12:03
viking_ice | greetings Mar 18 12:03
jlaska | f13: welcome Mar 18 12:03
--- | sspreitzer is now known as sspreitzer[AWAY] Mar 18 12:04
* | jlaska waits another minute or so Mar 18 12:04
adamw | yo Mar 18 12:06
jlaska | heyo! Mar 18 12:06
adamw | sorry, i am involved in a vigorous and enthusiastic discussion in -devel Mar 18 12:06
adamw | ;) Mar 18 12:06
jlaska | okay, I think we have critical mass Mar 18 12:06
jlaska | no worries :) Mar 18 12:06
jlaska | my goal is to keep this under 1 hour today ... so let's git'er done Mar 18 12:07
--- | jlaska has changed the topic to: Fedora QA Meeting | Follow-up from last meeting http://wwoods.fedorapeople.org/fedora-qa/fedora-qa-20090311.log.html Mar 18 12:07
jlaska | the best I can discern from last weeks minutes is the semantic open it Mar 18 12:07
jlaska | em Mar 18 12:07
jlaska | [jlaska&adamw] mediawiki semantic* packaging Mar 18 12:07
* | wwoods kinda here but will be leaving in a bit Mar 18 12:07
jlaska | wwoods: welcome! Mar 18 12:08
jlaska | made some good progress on the packaging, I decided not to bug adamw with that just yet since things were going fairly well Mar 18 12:08
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jlaska | one package reviewed and build ... another inprogress Mar 18 12:08
jlaska | * mediawiki-semantic http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/packageinfo?packageID=7968 Mar 18 12:08
jlaska | * mediawiki-semantic-forms package review bug#490171 Mar 18 12:08
buggbot | Bug https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=490171 medium, medium, ---, nobody, NEW, Review Request: mediawiki-semantic-forms - An extension to MediaWiki that adds support for web-based forms Mar 18 12:08
adamw | yes, I have been dynamically and enthusiastically leaving it to jlaska Mar 18 12:08
adamw | and expect full credit for this work =) Mar 18 12:09
jlaska | stickster and tibbs|h - thanks for guidance on the licensing for mediawiki-semantic-forms Mar 18 12:09
jlaska | adamw: hey, blame goes with the credit! :D Mar 18 12:09
jlaska | as far as next steps ... Mar 18 12:09
jlaska | * next steps to setup & configure a test instance and incorporate live data Mar 18 12:09
jlaska | I sent a request out ot fedora-infrastructure to see if I could get a dump of live wiki data for testing these extensions Mar 18 12:09
jlaska | this is definitely an area I could use assistance on Mar 18 12:10
jlaska | it's not hard to set this thing up at all ... just going to be important on how we document best practices etc... Mar 18 12:10
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jlaska | if anyone is interested in helping setup and play with mediawiki + semantic ... just let me know, I could use some extra eyes here Mar 18 12:11
jlaska | that's all I coudl pick out from last week's action items ... what did I miss? Mar 18 12:11
adamw | as i mentioned to you privately - poke fcami, as he requested it in the first place :) Mar 18 12:12
adamw | i'd like to play with it for test day results, but for that it needs to be up publicly somewhere really Mar 18 12:12
jlaska | indeed ... I'd like us to get really familiar with how to use this thing Mar 18 12:12
jlaska | once it's packaged, I can ask infrastructure for hosting and we can start playing around in a demo instance Mar 18 12:13
adamw | sure, i can come on board with playing about at that point. Mar 18 12:13
jlaska | great, that will be a big help Mar 18 12:13
jlaska | the guidance we have from the laptop.org folks is make sure we outline some best practices/policy before we unleash this Mar 18 12:14
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jlaska | ACTION: let's do another check-in next week on packaging, and hopefully status on a hosted demo site Mar 18 12:14
jlaska | any other topics from last week folks would like to raise status on? Mar 18 12:14
adamw | er, let me take a look at the summary for a sec Mar 18 12:15
jlaska | ... sure Mar 18 12:15
adamw | graphics test days - intel was held and successful Mar 18 12:15
adamw | still haven't organized radeon yet Mar 18 12:15
adamw | i'll send out a poke to the devs on that Mar 18 12:15
adamw | we're hoping to have an intel follow up later before f11's release, to test fixes for the issues identified at the first event Mar 18 12:16
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jlaska | ACTION: schedule radeon test day [adamw] Mar 18 12:16
jlaska | ^---- for my grepping sanity Mar 18 12:16
jlaska | adamw: nice job on the intel test day ... seems like you were very busy Mar 18 12:17
jlaska | lots of results (https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Test_Days/2009-03-12) and data still coming in on the mailing list Mar 18 12:17
jlaska | yesterday was also the DeviceKit test day (https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Test_Days/2009-03-17) Mar 18 12:18
--- | stickster is now known as stickster_food Mar 18 12:18
jlaska | we didn't get quite the turn out that Intel testing gathered Mar 18 12:18
jlaska | while a lot of the code for the DeviceKit feature is complete ... there are still interaction and UI quirks to iron out Mar 18 12:19
jlaska | so if folks have the time ... Live USB key + DeviceKit testing (https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:DeviceKit_Test_Cases) is the way to go Mar 18 12:20
jlaska | any other topics from last week? Mar 18 12:20
jlaska | okay ... on to F-11-Beta ... Mar 18 12:21
--- | jlaska has changed the topic to: Fedora QA meeting | F-11-Beta discussion Mar 18 12:21
jlaska | wwoods provided a bullet list of discussion points ... which I'll summarize as the who/what/when/where/why's of the F-11-Beta Mar 18 12:22
jlaska | > F-11 Schedule https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/11/Schedule Mar 18 12:22
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jlaska | f13: do you have any updates from release engineering with respect to the Beta? Mar 18 12:23
f13 | nothing good to say. Mar 18 12:23
f13 | anaconda still not ready. Mar 18 12:23
adamw | refer to the recent vigorous and enthusiastic discussion in -devel :) Mar 18 12:23
jlaska | from a schedule perspective, do you anticipate any changes there? Mar 18 12:24
f13 | if I don't get a golden tree in the form of tomorrow's rawhide, I think we slip. Mar 18 12:24
f13 | as it is we're damn close to the wire. Mar 18 12:24
jlaska | indeed ... Beta is scheduled to hit the mirrors on 03/24 ? Mar 18 12:25
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f13 | no, that's when its supposed to GA Mar 18 12:26
f13 | to hit that date, we have to be available to mirrors the 20th or the 21st Mar 18 12:26
jlaska | so a few days prior for the mirrors? Mar 18 12:26
jlaska | so we have < 2 days to compose then test a beta candidate? Mar 18 12:26
f13 | that is correct sir. Mar 18 12:27
jlaska | the current F11Beta blocker list isn't too bad ... but I think it's the what's lurking behind door#2 that concerns you? Mar 18 12:27
f13 | once again we're to the point of "either the one we finally get to make is right, or we slip" Mar 18 12:27
jlaska | F11Beta blockers - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/showdependencytree.cgi?id=476774&hide_resolved=1 Mar 18 12:27
f13 | jlaska: I think a /lot/ of the storage bugs just aren't filed and/or listed in F11Beta Mar 18 12:28
jlaska | what information do you need to make a slip vs no slip recommendation? Mar 18 12:28
f13 | a real good idea of what storage bugs exist Mar 18 12:28
f13 | a what works, vs what doesn't work, vs what hasn't been tested Mar 18 12:29
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jlaska | so that leads us to the test results wiki page created by wwoods https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:Fedora_11_Beta_Install_Test_Results Mar 18 12:29
f13 | I'm making some pre-beta candidate images right now in phx that has today's rawhide + newer anaconda and python-pyblock Mar 18 12:29
f13 | jlaska: well the installer guys know some of this, but they aren't sharing with bugzilla. Mar 18 12:30
adamw | so basically you need us/bugzappers to be looking through anaconda storage bugs and trying to get appropriate ones on the blocker list? Mar 18 12:30
jlaska | adamw: is that possible? I'd be curious what total number of untriaged isntallation bugs we have post F11-Alpha Mar 18 12:31
f13 | adamw: yes, but again I think a lot of the known issues just aren't filed as bugs Mar 18 12:31
jlaska | I suspect we had a few test blockers that prevent us from hitting more interesting installer bugs Mar 18 12:31
adamw | jlaska: i'll see if anyone in Bugzappers would be willing to look at that Mar 18 12:31
adamw | jlaska: i can give you a number on untriaged installation bugs, btw, give me a few seconds Mar 18 12:31
jlaska | adamw: thank you Mar 18 12:32
f13 | and part of that problem has been new bugs introduced with changes to fix old bugs preventing further install testing. Mar 18 12:32
adamw | jlaska: what date did alpha come out, off the top of your head? Mar 18 12:32
jlaska | around 2009-02-01 Mar 18 12:32
jlaska | timestamp = 1233543911.73 Mar 18 12:32
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jlaska | f13: are we at the point where we have enough confidence that we can reach out for beta install testers to help flesh out https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:Fedora_11_Beta_Install_Test_Results Mar 18 12:33
adamw | ok - there are 42 bugs in NEW status filed on any anaconda component in rawhide since 2009-02-01 Mar 18 12:33
adamw | this is the list: Mar 18 12:33
adamw | https://bugzilla.redhat.com/buglist.cgi?query_format=advanced&classification=Fedora&product=Fedora&component=anaconda&component=anaconda-help&component=anaconda-images&component=anaconda-yum-plugins&version=rawhide&bug_status=NEW&chfieldfrom=2009-02-01&chfieldto=Now&chfield=[Bug%20creation] Mar 18 12:33
buggbot | <http://tinyurl.com/dgtlnk> (at bugzilla.redhat.com) Mar 18 12:33
f13 | jlaska: yes, although we may have to feed them updates.img files Mar 18 12:34
adamw | NEW status means it's untriaged (and unlikely to have been touched by bugzappers or maintainers) Mar 18 12:34
f13 | jlaska: we should have had them banging away at the results page from the day of freeze Mar 18 12:34
jlaska | f13: certainly earlier the better ... not sure how much progress we would have made given some key test blockers on storage Mar 18 12:35
adamw | f13: so it would be useful to you for qa/bugzappers to go through that list and get appropriate ones onto the blocker list? if so i'll try and get that done. Mar 18 12:35
f13 | jlaska: we would have at least known where the bugs were and had them recorded in bugzilla. Mar 18 12:35
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jlaska | f13: possibly ... but that's what test blockers are ... we don't konw what lurks behind them Mar 18 12:35
f13 | adamw: sure, it'll give us something to review for block/noblock. Mar 18 12:35
f13 | jlaska: at this point, we don't even know what the test blockers /are/ Mar 18 12:35
jlaska | f13: but I agree knowing more at this point would arm us well for a beta recommendation Mar 18 12:35
jlaska | okay, I'll take an action item to put out a request for testing assistance Mar 18 12:36
jlaska | ACTION: [jlaska] email f-t-list with request for pre-beta test feedback in https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:Fedora_11_Beta_Install_Test_Results Mar 18 12:37
f13 | and a note somewhere that this page needs to be available at or before the freeze and we need to start getting results recorded at or before the freeze. Mar 18 12:37
jlaska | f13: can you get me a link or info on the updates.img (or if you can post directly to that wiki page)? Mar 18 12:37
f13 | I don't know if there is one being passed around yet today Mar 18 12:37
jlaska | f13: ah okay, I may have misunderstood a previous comment Mar 18 12:38
jlaska | I'm not aware of one for today either Mar 18 12:38
f13 | well, I saw mention of some but I think that's for further develoipment on storage branch not necessarily fixing critical beta bugs. Mar 18 12:38
jlaska | we still have an open issue that I don't think we have sufficient time to fill out the matrix Mar 18 12:39
jlaska | so as is usually the case, we may need ot make a decision with what info we have available Mar 18 12:39
jlaska | f13: if there are some high-level use cases related to installation that would give you a better sense for this release, we might choose to narrow the request for testing around those areas? Mar 18 12:40
jlaska | which reminds me ... anyone have the link for the Beta release notes so we can begin to drop content there? Mar 18 12:40
f13 | I don't know off hand, what is our "critical" path for beta? Mar 18 12:40
f13 | autopart using existing Linux, autopart using free space, autopart using entire disk, all of those + encryption Mar 18 12:41
f13 | various levels of custom partitioning Mar 18 12:41
f13 | clearing off existing LVM sets Mar 18 12:41
jlaska | everything from the part type screen was my initial focus for the storage test day Mar 18 12:41
jlaska | yeah you're list above is what I had in mind as well Mar 18 12:42
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jlaska | f13: okay, I'll see if we need to adjust the test results wiki accordingly and request focus on those areas Mar 18 12:42
jlaska | when should we review the results ... Friday? Mar 18 12:42
f13 | that's too late Mar 18 12:43
f13 | either thursday's rawhide (that's tomorrow) is good enough for beta, or we slip. Mar 18 12:43
jlaska | so end of day tomorrow? Mar 18 12:43
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f13 | jlaska: end of day, or first critical breakage, whichever comes first Mar 18 12:44
jlaska | sounds good ... we'll be in touch :D Mar 18 12:44
jlaska | okay ... any other comments on the Beta ? Mar 18 12:44
jlaska | adamw: do you think we can have the OPEN issues scrubbed in time for tomorrow by end of day? Mar 18 12:45
jlaska | OPEN == (NEW anaconda bugs) Mar 18 12:45
f13 | wait a sec, is this meeting an hour early today? Mar 18 12:45
jlaska | yes Mar 18 12:46
f13 | ok, no wonder my alarm didn't go off Mar 18 12:46
jlaska | f13: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2009-March/msg00965.html Mar 18 12:46
f13 | I haven't gotten to email yet Mar 18 12:46
jlaska | no worries Mar 18 12:46
adamw | jlaska: i've sent requests to the irc chan and mailing list Mar 18 12:46
jlaska | adamw: thanks ... we'll see where we are tomorrow then Mar 18 12:46
adamw | jlaska: iarly is going to help out now, i will try and do some myself later too Mar 18 12:46
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jlaska | My google fu is failing to find a Beta release notes wiki page ... anyone know if that exists yet? Mar 18 12:47
jlaska | https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/11/Beta/ReleaseNotes is empty Mar 18 12:47
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jlaska | ... I'll find out an include in the minutes Mar 18 12:47
jlaska | ... okay rounding 3rd base </bad_sports_analogy> ... Mar 18 12:48
--- | stickster_food is now known as stickster_afk Mar 18 12:48
--- | jlaska has changed the topic to: Fedora QA meeting | Upcoming QA events Mar 18 12:48
jlaska | adamw has 2 test days upcoming ... Mar 18 12:48
jlaska | tomorrow > XFCE Test Day [1] Mar 18 12:48
adamw | xfce is pretty much planned except i need to finish off the test cases. i'll get that done today Mar 18 12:49
jlaska | and the following thursday > Nouveau Test Day [2] Mar 18 12:49
adamw | should've been promoted yesterday but i didn't have time, la la. Mar 18 12:49
* | nirik was finally able to make xfce live isos and test last night. Hurray. Mar 18 12:49
jlaska | adamw: you've got the mic ... Mar 18 12:49
adamw | nirik: ooh. could if we could have those available for the test day it'd be awesome Mar 18 12:49
nirik | yeah, I can see about uploading somewhere. Mar 18 12:49
viking_ice | spins ready for test day? Mar 18 12:50
adamw | nouveau is mostly ready too, still need to have the rendercheck packaging done (i'll bug ben about that), but we could go ahead without it. a live CD would be really great for that also. Mar 18 12:50
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jlaska | adamw: we can do the livecd for nouveau, I can build images and request hosting from jeremy (who has more quota) Mar 18 12:50
viking_ice | rule of thumb hw test == we need to hva livecd Mar 18 12:50
viking_ice | ready Mar 18 12:50
jlaska | viking_ice: agreed, the live images have been *very* handy for those test days Mar 18 12:50
adamw | nirik: jeremy has gigantic quota, we've just been sticking live CDs in his space for now. we could remove older ones after a while and update the link on the test day pages to point to the nwer ones. Mar 18 12:51
viking_ice | there were atleast 2 on the intel test day Mar 18 12:51
viking_ice | that needed live ( willing to test not willing to break box ) Mar 18 12:51
nirik | adamw: cool. If someone could make some and stick them up there that would be great. Mar 18 12:51
jlaska | nirik: you need someone to build the images for XFCE? Mar 18 12:52
nirik | I did make some minor ks changes last night. Requested them for the beta... so if you could, spin them from git head Mar 18 12:52
nirik | jlaska: well, I can build them here, but not sure how long upload will take. ;) If someone is closer net wise and has good upload that might be faster. Mar 18 12:52
f13 | I need to drop off so that I can get ready for my next meeting. Mar 18 12:53
adamw | jlaska: if you could help me out there it'd be awesome, i still haven't got used to the generator and i'm looking to have a busy rest of today with the xfce test cases and installer triaging stuff. plus i've got a haircut this afternoon :) Mar 18 12:53
jlaska | nirik: if you can send me which spin-kickstarts/ file are you using I can ask if jeremy can post them for us? Mar 18 12:53
jlaska | f13: roger, see you soon Mar 18 12:53
jlaska | adamw: you do need a haircut! Mar 18 12:53
jlaska | :) Mar 18 12:53
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adamw | jlaska: hmm, when you saw me i'd had one quite recently :P Mar 18 12:53
jlaska | jk ;) Mar 18 12:53
nirik | jlaska: sure, basically the xfce one from git head of spins-kickstarts. Mar 18 12:54
jlaska | okay Mar 18 12:54
jlaska | I'll talk to jeremy and se if we can have something posted for tomorrow Mar 18 12:54
jlaska | unless anyone else wants to grab that one? Mar 18 12:54
nirik | http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/?p=spin-kickstarts.git;a=blob;f=fedora-livecd-xfce.ks;h=b97e245b94843596c1026d265a181e30e0dfe784;hb=9ec863778654f5462ab33300181ec1a9348d58ef Mar 18 12:54
nirik | man, thats ugly. Mar 18 12:54
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jlaska | nirik: no worries, I have the link Mar 18 12:54
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jlaska | okay folks ... I need to cut out shortly, and we're approaching out 1hr limit Mar 18 12:55
--- | jlaska has changed the topic to: Fedora QA meeting | Open Discussion Mar 18 12:55
jlaska | are there any topics folks would like to discuss before we close out? Mar 18 12:56
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nirik | just FYI, I should be around for Xfce tomorrow, but I am on MDT, so will not be in until 9am (11am EDT). Mar 18 12:57
jlaska | nirik: okay, thanks for update Mar 18 12:57
viking_ice | wp instance for announcements stuck in infrastructure Mar 18 12:58
jlaska | viking_ice: do you have a link to the ticket? Mar 18 12:58
viking_ice | 12456 Mar 18 12:59
viking_ice | 1245 Mar 18 12:59
viking_ice | it's 1245 Mar 18 12:59
viking_ice | perhaps maintainers/developers should introduce them self as such when reply on the test list Mar 18 12:59
jlaska | https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1245 Mar 18 13:00
viking_ice | yup Mar 18 13:00
adamw | viking_ice: that'd be nice but probably unlikely to be possible :\ trying to get maintainers to do anything like that is like herding cats... Mar 18 13:00
viking_ice | sandeen: has been getting hard time getting testers to do what they need to do for him to diagnose the problem Mar 18 13:01
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viking_ice | Well hey smug me maintain you do this ok and file a report with output Mar 18 13:01
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jlaska | viking_ice: hrmm, interesting idea ... I'm going to put this down as a discussion point Mar 18 13:02
viking_ice | well a whole sysrq wiki page got written Mar 18 13:02
jlaska | yeah that was good stuff! Mar 18 13:02
viking_ice | jlaska: there is also an rfe that wont get work on until the webpage is setup Mar 18 13:02
viking_ice | for a notifier-applet in gnome Mar 18 13:03
jlaska | viking_ice: can you post the link for the minutes? Mar 18 13:03
viking_ice | which link ? Mar 18 13:03
jlaska | SysRq Mar 18 13:03
jlaska | I've got to drop off folks, thanks for the meeting Mar 18 13:03
jlaska | minutes to follow on the list, let's continue discussion in #fedora-qa and on fedora-test-list@redhat.com Mar 18 13:03
viking_ice | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Sysrq Mar 18 13:04
jlaska | viking_ice: thanks! Mar 18 13:04
viking_ice | well christo moved it there Mar 18 13:04
--- | jlaska has changed the topic to: Channel is used by various Fedora groups and committees for their regular meetings | Note that meetings often get logged | For questions about using Fedora please ask in #fedora | See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting_channel for meeting schedule Mar 18 13:04

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