QA/Meetings/20110926

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Contents

Attendees

  • tflink (113)
  • adamw (82)
  • drago01 (20)
  • maxamillion (17)
  • kparal (8)
  • satellit_ (8)
  • nirik (7)
  • abadger1999 (6)
  • zodbot (3)
  • athmane (3)
  • jsmith (3)
  • jskladan (1)
  • pschindl (1)

Agenda

Previous meeting follow-up

  • tflink reported that the review of python-yourls is complete and he just needed to do the initial build
  • abadger1999 said that the pkgdb/package-specific test case link might not happen for a while if no-one submits a patch, but he would welcome a ticket
  • maxamillion filed the ticket during the course of the meeting

Xen Release Criteria

  • The group agreed that Xen functionality should not block Beta release, but may block Final release
  • It was noted that Xen DomU support may affect EC2 support

Beta Preparation

  • This section of the meeting again turned into a beta blocker review meeting: see log for details

Action Items

  • tflink to build python-yourls for F15, F16, EL6 and create updates
  • maxamillion to follow up with abadger1999 on the idea of linking from pkgdb to the list of package-specific test cases
  • maxamillion create ticket for pkgdb to link to package-specific test cases
  • tflink to start discussion about Xen DomU for Final Release Criteria

IRC Log

tflink #startmeeting Fedora QA Meeting 15:01
zodbot Meeting started Mon Sep 26 15:01:18 2011 UTC. The chair is tflink. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 15:01
zodbot Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 15:01
* pschindl is here 15:01
tflink #chair adamw 15:01
zodbot Current chairs: adamw tflink 15:01
tflink #topic roll call 15:01
adamw yo 15:01
* jskladan lurks from the shadows 15:01
tflink alrighty, who's around for this last-minute meeting? 15:01
* tflink set a reminder for the announcement for next week 15:01
tflink jskladan, pschindl: welcome 15:02
tflink adamw: did you have anything special in mind for an agenda other than followup, beta status and probably a mini-review? 15:02
* jsmith is here 15:04
jsmith (Lurking, mostly) 15:04
* nirik is also lurking in the shadows. 15:04
* tflink welcomes the shadows of jsmith and nirik 15:05
adamw we could look at the Xen release criterion 15:05
adamw as people keep poking me about that 15:05
tflink good idea 15:05
tflink ok, lets get started 15:06
tflink #topic previous meeting followup 15:06
tflink first up is "adamw to check in with tflink about python-yourls" 15:07
tflink which I don't think happened, but I can update status anyways :) 15:07
tflink the review is complete and code is committed, I just need to build packages and create updates 15:07
tflink #action tflink to build python-yourls for F15, F16, EL6 and create updates 15:08
* kparal joins in late 15:08
adamw i think i tried but you weren't on the end of whatever i pinged 15:08
tflink next up is "maxamillion to follow up with abadger1999 on the idea of linking from pkgdb to the list of package-specific test cases for a package" 15:08
adamw hi kparal 15:08
* kparal was buying travel adapter for fudcon, sorry 15:08
tflink maxamillion doesn't seem to be here atm 15:08
adamw i pinged him in -qa but no reply as yet 15:10
adamw abadger1999: has that been followed up on? 15:10
abadger1999 nope, hasn't. 15:10
tflink so I guess we table this and add another action 15:10
adamw 'maxa to really damn well do it this week' 15:11
abadger1999 If someone wants to add it as a separate page linked from the package's acl page, I'll take the patch immediately. 15:11
tflink #action maxamillion to follow up with abadger1999 on the idea of liking from pkgdb to the list of package-specific test cases 15:11
abadger1999 Otherwise I'd est. a year out or so. 15:11
abadger1999 I need to coordinate two pkgdb releases this year.. which means lots of coordination and bugfixing will be my priorities. 15:11
abadger1999 please open a ticket if no one is working on it here, though -- I do have people who come to me looking for programming tasks and I think this is an intermediate level task so I could give it to one of them. 15:13
adamw okay. thanks 15:13
tflink #info if package-specific test case linking in pkgdb is desired, someone is going to have to write a patch for it 15:13
tflink anyone want to take an action on creating that ticket? 15:13
* maxamillion is here 15:14
tflink an you already have an #action :) 15:14
tflink maxamillion: would you be OK with creating the ticket to have the linking to pkg-specific test cases in pkgdb? 15:15
tflink wow, that was oddly worded 15:15
tflink ok, no volunteers so it'll be maxamillion or I 15:16
maxamillion tflink: sure, I could do that ... not entirely sure where to file the ticket though, just need to track that down 15:16
* maxamillion goes to the googles 15:16
tflink #action maxamillion create ticket for pkgdb to link to package-specific test cases 15:16
tflink ok, I think that's all of the followup from last week 15:16
tflink did I miss anything? 15:16
* tflink assumes that silence means "no" 15:17
abadger1999 maxamillion: https://fedorahosted.org/packagedb/ and target it towards -- someone that I might assign it to that comes to infra looking to help. 15:17
tflink #topic Xen Release Criteria 15:17
maxamillion abadger1999: ah, rgr .. thanks :D 15:18
tflink this came up in the comments for https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=708267 which is currently proposed as a F16 beta blocker 15:18
tflink #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=708267 15:18
adamw soo...we currently have Beta release criterion which reads "The release must boot successfully as a virtual guest in a situation where the virtual host is running a supported Xen implementation" 15:18
tflink I thought that was something that came from infra 15:19
adamw afaict this criterion is sort of a vestigial tail of the criteria: it was request by jesse at the time, and so we think there was something in releng/infra back then which actually needed xen to work 15:19
tflink since they're still running Xen AFAIK 15:19
adamw that's what we think 15:19
adamw i went and asked jesse and the current releng team if they think we should still have it, and they said no 15:20
* nirik notes xen is still in use, but with no fedora guests. Our fedora compose box is bare hw. 15:20
adamw i haven't checked with infra (yet) 15:20
* tflink has F15 DomUs running, doesn't quite understand the problem 15:20
adamw so, i'm planning to propose we drop the criterion 15:20
adamw tflink: as in, the bug? let's not get off track if possible =) the question isn't whether it works right now, but whether it needs to be in the beta criteia 15:21
adamw criteria* 15:21
tflink the only objection I have to that is that Dom0 is a F16 feature 15:21
maxamillion tflink: +1 15:21
adamw feature process isn't blocker process, we already established that. =) 15:21
maxamillion ah 15:21
maxamillion crap ... rbb 15:21
maxamillion brb* 15:22
tflink it seems odd that we would advertize the ability to run Fedora as Dom0 but not support DomU 15:22
nirik so, change it for f17 to be 'must boot as a guest in a fedora dom0' ? 15:22
adamw tflink: minus ten points for using the S word! 15:22
adamw the concept of 'support' is so vague as to be unhelpful, really, and the release criteria are certainly not an exhaustive list of everything fedora could be said to 'support' in some sense 15:22
adamw the release criteria are supposed to be the stuff that absolutely needs to be working for us to consider the release, well, releasable 15:23
tflink either way, I'm not sure that Xen DomU needs to be a beta criterion 15:23
adamw do we really think we should slip the release another week if Xen support isn't working? 15:23
adamw is the essential question 15:23
* nirik doesn't. 15:23
tflink for beta, probably not 15:24
* athmane thinks that xen domu support is NTH 15:24
tflink for final, maybe 15:24
adamw okay 15:25
tflink using the same argument that we have for live images - if people are installing from DVD media, its harder to work around installation issues 15:25
* adamw doesn't quite follow the parallel 15:25
tflink if creating a Xen DomU from DVD media fails, how do you update to fix that? 15:25
adamw oh, i see. reasonable point. 15:26
adamw so, let's say we all agree it's not Beta material, but it's not clear whether it should be final material or not 15:26
tflink yeah, that works for me 15:26
adamw and we can discuss further on the list? 15:26
maxamillion back 15:26
maxamillion +1 for not beta 15:27
athmane also we don't have a working dom0 in fedora to test (unlike kvm) 15:27
tflink proposed #agreed - Xen DomU Beta release criterion was rejected, unclear on whether or not DomU should be a final criterion, will discuss more on list 15:27
tflink athmane: supposedly it works in F16 15:27
tflink #agreed - Xen DomU Beta release criterion was rejected, unclear on whether or not DomU should be a final criterion, will discuss more on list 15:28
* nirik notes that ec2 stuff is dom0 right? so that might affect that part of the compose for final? 15:28
tflink nirik: good point 15:29
tflink #action tflink to start discussion about Xen DomU for Final Release Criteria 15:29
tflink #info EC2 is Xen, DomU support may affect EC2 support 15:29
maxamillion athmane: we don't? I thought that stuff was merged upstream into the 3.0.x kernel line 15:30
* maxamillion hasn't tested it though ... so ... :/ 15:30
nirik yeah, it's supposed to work... dunno if anyone has tested it much. 15:30
maxamillion I plan to test this week 15:30
* tflink hasn't heard a whole lot on the xen list 15:30
tflink fedora-xen, rather 15:30
tflink any other thoughts before we move on? 15:31
maxamillion it might be a bit late but I might post to the fedora virtualization test day wiki page but note that I tested Xen instead of KVM 15:31
nirik There was one tester a few weeks ago running into issues, but dunno if they got it working or not. ;( 15:31
athmane Xen Pvops Dom0 feature seems to be at 75% 15:31
maxamillion athmane: well, that's what the wiki page says anyways ... but I wouldn't be surprised if that was out of date 15:32
tflink the last message I'm seeing on fedora-xen sounds like it's farther along than 75% 15:32
tflink we'll see what happens 15:33
tflink #topic Beta Preparation 15:33
tflink #info Fedora 16 Beta RC2 was released last friday 15:33
tflink the install and desktop test matrices look decent, still a couple of holes 15:34
tflink 4 bugs were (re) proposed as blockers over the weekend 15:35
adamw yeah, we need some coverage, but no obvious showstoppers seem to have emerged 15:35
tflink other than nfs installs? 15:35
tflink wait, 5 bugs, I missed one 15:36
tflink well, sounds like time for a mini-review before we call this meeting over 15:37
tflink #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Current_Release_Blockers 15:37
tflink #topic (741211) "save traceback to bugzilla" test doesn't work when using randomize_tb to create a new bug 15:37
tflink #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=741211 15:37
adamw oh, not that fucking one again. 15:38
tflink is this really distribution? 15:38
tflink I thought that we fixed this already 15:38
adamw this is https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=730887 15:39
kparal maybe the updates.img contains bad code? 15:39
tflink adamw: that was libreport 15:39
adamw looks like the same problem again. 15:39
tflink regression from the last libreport update? 15:40
adamw possibly. 15:40
tflink proposed #agreed - 741221 - AcceptedBlocker - The installer must be able to report failures to Bugzilla, with appropriate information included 15:40
tflink ack/nak/patch? 15:40
adamw yeah, looks ack-y. 15:41
adamw and re-assign to libreport. 15:41
* satellit_ in RC-2 Beta netinstall -last night-I was not able to send bug to bugzilla I could only save bug results locally. (gnome 3.1.92) 15:41
tflink proposed #agreed - 741221 - AcceptedBlocker - The installer must be able to report failures to Bugzilla, with appropriate information included. This needs to be re-assigned to libreport 15:41
kparal +1 15:41
tflink #agreed - 741221 - AcceptedBlocker - The installer must be able to report failures to Bugzilla, with appropriate information included. This needs to be re-assigned to libreport 15:42
tflink #topic (737093) [abrt] gjs-1.29.17-1.fc16: strcmp: Process /usr/bin/gjs-console was killed by signal 11 (SIGSEGV) 15:42
tflink #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737093 15:42
adamw this is what happens when we take new upstreams as nth. grmph 15:43
adamw looks like they dropped all patches when bumping to 2.0.5.980 but that one got lost upstream... 15:44
* satellit_ https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737093#c11 15:44
kparal satellit_: netinstall probably installed newer version from updates-testing 15:45
satellit_ it worked 15:45
tflink what is the documents favorite? 15:45
adamw gnome-documents 15:45
adamw new app 15:45
adamw the easy fix for this is just to not have it in the Dash in beta 15:45
adamw i meant to propose this and get it fixed ahead of rc2 but forgot :( 15:45
* tflink doesn't see it in RC2 live 15:45
adamw anyone see it in rc2 dvd? 15:46
adamw if not, we're good... 15:46
satellit_ yes but it fails 15:46
tflink nvm, it's there but just not on the favorites panel 15:46
adamw tflink: no, that matters 15:46
tflink and it crashes for me\ 15:46
adamw it's only a beta blocker if it's on the Dash by default 15:46
adamw which I think is what you're calling the 'favorites' 15:47
adamw if it's only there by browsing through or searching the whole set of applications, it's a final blocker, not beta 15:47
tflink whatever the bar is that gets the apps added as "favorites" (far left in overview) 15:47
adamw right - which has, like, Firefox, install to hard disk, nautilus and whatever else as default, right? 15:47
adamw if that doesn't have Documents on it, we're good 15:48
* tflink realizes that he's missing a lot of terms for gnome-shell 15:48
tflink yeah, by default it has ff, evolution, rhythmbox, shotwell, files and install 15:48
tflink so -1 beta blocker, +1 final blocker for me 15:48
adamw for beta we only require 'elements of the default panel configuration' to work without crashimg 15:49
drago01 the "bar" is called "dash" 15:49
adamw (i'd count the Dash in that as it basically replaces the quick launchers in an old panel) 15:49
adamw for final we require any app present on the menu system by default to at least pass a smell test 15:49
drago01 whats the bug? (sorry just joined) 15:49
adamw gnome-documents insta-crashing 15:49
drago01 ah ok 15:50
adamw it's a fairly well known bug, but as long as it's not in Dash by default in Beta, we're okay. 15:50
tflink proposed #agreed - 737093 - RejectedBetaBlocker, AcceptedFinalBlocker - gnome-documents isn't on the dash for Beta RC2 and therefore crashing isn't a beta blocker. However, it does hit the final criterion - "All applications listed under the Applications menu or category must withstand a basic functionality test and not crash after a few minutes of normal use. They must also have working Help and Help -> About menu items " 15:50
tflink ack/nak/patch? 15:50
drago01 it should be ... (it is in the upstream default dash) 15:50
jsmith ACK 15:50
kparal ack 15:50
drago01 wait 15:51
drago01 it is supposed to be in the dash by default (if it isn't it is just a bug or an outdated shell build) 15:51
drago01 what do we ship in the beta? 15:51
adamw drago01: 'outdated shell build', most likely 15:51
adamw beta does not have 3.1.92 and isn't going to be 15:51
tflink drago01: it isn't on the dash for the beta RC2 image I'm running 15:52
tflink running gnome-shell-3.1.91-2 15:52
drago01 adamw: ok 15:52
drago01 tflink: should be in 3.1.90 15:53
adamw pretty sure it wasn't. 15:53
drago01 http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-shell/commit/?id=0133c6e174e705865adf97ed8cce11581d783c49 15:54
satellit_ adamw: I do have it here on DVD RC2 Beta install to HD done last night 3.1.91 15:54
adamw satellit_: network repo enabled or not? 15:55
adamw ah. 15:55
drago01 it would only not show up when 1) gnome-documents isn't installed or 2) update from previous build and same user 15:55
adamw i think we override the list in the live image 15:55
satellit_ only DVD as repo 15:55
adamw but not on the DVD 15:55
adamw fedora-live-desktop.ks:favorite-apps=['mozilla-firefox.desktop', 'evolution.desktop', 'empathy.desktop', 'rhythmbox.desktop', 'shotwell.desktop', 'openoffice.org-writer.desktop', 'nautilus.desktop', 'anaconda.desktop'] 15:55
adamw so if it's there in a DVD install...blocker. 15:55
drago01 ah that explains it 15:55
adamw well, this is going to be funsies to fix. 15:56
* kparal will be back in 5 15:56
tflink I thought that the proposed fix was to just not have it on the dash for beta? 15:57
adamw tflink: yeah, but it'll be a bit tricky logistically 15:57
satellit_ someone else has confirmed this ? on HD install 15:57
adamw as that will require a gnome-shell build lower than 3.1.92 15:57
* tflink can do an RC2 install in a bit 15:57
adamw satellit_: it sounds right: it's kinda what we'd expect 15:57
satellit_ ok 15:58
drago01 "remove from beta and add it later" isn't a fix imo 15:58
drago01 the beta should be as close to final as possible 15:58
adamw drago01: that's not practical. it'd never be done. 15:58
drago01 good 15:58
adamw as in, we would never be able to ship the beta. have you seen the delta of f16 'stable' vs. updates-testing atm>? 15:59
tflink proposed #agreed - 737093 - AcceptedBlocker - gnome-documents is on the dash by default for dvd installs and hits the beta criterion "No part of any release-blocking desktop's panel (or equivalent) configuration should crash or be entirely non-functional on boot of the installed system using default installation choices" 15:59
drago01 adamw: no but I suspect it be rather large by now 15:59
adamw drago01: right. if we were trying to put all that stuff in the beta, it'd just be impossible. we have to freeze. the freeze periods have already been pared to the bone. 16:00
adamw tflink: ack 16:00
drago01 adamw: my point was not "add everything from updates testing" but rather "don't pull random stuff out and add it post beta" 16:01
tflink drago01: other suggestions that don't involve pulling in a new gnome-shell et. al.? 16:01
tflink any other votes on the changed proposal? 16:02
drago01 tflink: ping cosimoc / walters re gnome-documents crash and see whether it can be fixed in time or not 16:02
adamw drago01: it's not 'random stuff'. it's stuff that break the beta criteria. 16:02
tflink #info ping cosimoc / walters re gnome-documents crash and see whether it can be fixed in time or not 16:03
drago01 adamw: also instead of doing hack builds ... you could just remove gnome-documents from the default install 16:03
adamw that were mostly written by the desktop team in the first place, and that dictate what's supposed to go into the release. 16:03
drago01 (no conflict with updates-testing etc( 16:03
adamw drago01: yeah, that was what i just thought too. 16:03
tflink #agreed - 737093 - AcceptedBlocker - gnome-documents is on the dash by default for dvd installs and hits the beta criterion "No part of any release-blocking desktop's panel (or equivalent) configuration should crash or be entirely non-functional on boot of the installed system using default installation choices" 16:03
tflink #topic (708267) Fedora 15 cannot install as a DomU, Fails to find hard disk virtual device 16:04
tflink #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=708267 16:04
tflink since we talked about Xen earlier ... 16:05
tflink proposed #agreed - 708267 - RejectedBlocker - Xen DomU support is no longer a Beta criterion, will revisit if/when DomU support is accepted as a Final criterion 16:06
adamw ack 16:07
tflink it got quiet in here all of a sudden 16:07
tflink #agreed - 708267 - RejectedBlocker - Xen DomU support is no longer a Beta criterion, will revisit if/when DomU support is accepted as a Final criterion 16:07
adamw i think people are staging a silent protest against >1hr meetings =) 16:08
maxamillion Re: pkgdb test case action item --> https://fedorahosted.org/packagedb/ticket/223 16:08
* tflink proposes that we forgo discussion of the 2 re-opened blockers 16:09
tflink in the meeting, anyways 16:09
tflink maxamillion: thanks for the update 16:10
adamw tflink: fine by me 16:10
adamw actually... 16:10
adamw on the nfs ISO one, we probably need a bit more testing 16:10
maxamillion tflink: certainly, sorry for the delay ... I'm attempting to multitask and hitting a lot of context switching overhead :X 16:11
tflink maxamillion: no worries 16:11
tflink adamw: I can try that out today 16:11
adamw tflink: awesome, thanks 16:11
tflink other than that ... 16:12
adamw i'm gonna work the new acceptedblockers 16:12
tflink #topic Open Discussion 16:12
tflink adamw: are you playing secretary or am I? 16:12
tflink #info pkgdb test case action item --> https://fedorahosted.org/packagedb/ticket/223 16:12
adamw tflink: i've done a few 16:12
tflink ok, since pretty much everyone has disappeared ... fuse set for 2 minutes 16:13
kparal not disappeared, just switched to read-only mode :) 16:14
tflink kparal: will keep that in mind next time we need ack/vote :) 16:15
tflink ok, thanks for coming everyone! 16:15
* tflink will send out minutes shortly 16:15
tflink #endmeeting 16:15

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