Meeting:IRC Support SIG 2009-01-22

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---nirik has changed the topic to: IRC Support SIG - Init process Jan 22 09:30
nirik hey all, who's around for the irc support sig meeting? Jan 22 09:30
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*thomasj present Jan 22 09:31
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Southern_Gentlem here not not Jan 22 09:31
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hpachas-PE RodrigoPadula, hola Jan 22 09:32
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*nirik will wait a minute or two more for folks to trickle in. Jan 22 09:33
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*so_solid_moo will be here for this meeting too then :) Jan 22 09:34
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nirik humm... ok, I guess we can start in... Jan 22 09:38
---nirik has changed the topic to: IRC Support SIG - Classroom Jan 22 09:38
nirik we have some more classes coming up in feb... Jan 22 09:38
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nirik so if anyone wants to teach or knows someone who would, let me know. Jan 22 09:39
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nirik also, we should probibly start doing some advertising a week or so in advance. Jan 22 09:39
herlo ooh, we should advertise :) Jan 22 09:39
*herlo will help with that... Jan 22 09:39
nirik yeah. ;) Anyhow, just thought I would mention it... Jan 22 09:40
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nirik herlo: we should meet up sometime and come up with advertising/brainstorming/sessions. ;) Jan 22 09:40
nirik anyhow, moving along... Jan 22 09:41
---nirik has changed the topic to: IRC Support SIG - hot topics Jan 22 09:41
nirik Another hairbrained Idea I have had. How about we try and come up with at the meeting each week the top 5 bugs we see lots of users hitting, and then post that list to the devel and/or testing lists. Jan 22 09:42
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nirik anyone think thats a good idea? bad one? Jan 22 09:43
thomasj Hmm.. not a bad one. Jan 22 09:43
nirik ie, give developers more info on what bugs users are hitting in the last week (at least from a biased sample of irc users) Jan 22 09:44
vwbusguy we should do more to encourage end users to bugzilla themselves Jan 22 09:45
vwbusguy it really is a better scenario if the end users who are themselves experiencing the problem are involved in the bug process Jan 22 09:45
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so_solid_moo bugzilla isn't a particularly nice tool to use though Jan 22 09:45
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nirik sure, but I am saying things like the intel video lockup bug, or the no sound for some intel-hda sound cards in a particular kernel. Jan 22 09:46
vwbusguy so_solid_moo, that is something beyond our scope Jan 22 09:46
vwbusguy nirik, both of those have very long CC lists on the bugs as well Jan 22 09:46
nirik not sure it's really that usefull... but just an idea. Jan 22 09:46
thomasj nirik, you think that would fix the bugs faster? ;) Jan 22 09:46
nirik agreed. It would be more usefull for something thats just coming up and starting to happen. Jan 22 09:46
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so_solid_moo vwbusguy, sure, but I'm thinking that trying to expose people to more bz might just frustrate them Jan 22 09:48
thomasj Makes them part of the community. Not just user. Jan 22 09:49
nirik alternately, we could look at the list of common bugs we are seeing a lot over a week and see if any could be added to common bugs. Jan 22 09:49
thomasj +1 Jan 22 09:49
nirik that might have more positive impact. Jan 22 09:51
nirik so, what are the hot issues people have been seeing this week? Jan 22 09:51
thomasj still snd-hda-intel Jan 22 09:52
thomasj aka, alsa Jan 22 09:53
nirik yeah, the intel video lockup I have seen a few times... Jan 22 09:53
nirik anyhow, just an idea... I guess you all can ponder on it and we can try next week? Jan 22 09:54
thomasj else some smaller issues, like the rpmdb gets corrupted in F10 more often than in prior releases. Jan 22 09:54
thomasj dunno why. Jan 22 09:54
thomasj sure we can ponder on it. Jan 22 09:55
nirik there was an issue with ext4 and rpmdb... Jan 22 09:55
nirik anyhow, thought I would throw it out there. Jan 22 09:56
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nirik ok, moving on... Jan 22 09:57
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---nirik has changed the topic to: IRC Support SIG - getting people involved Jan 22 09:57
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nirik I think one of the areas we could improve on is pointing people to resouces for getting involved... Jan 22 09:58
nirik ie, if someone suggests something, or an improvement, point them to the join page or the subproject sig where that change would be made. Jan 22 09:58
thomasj The wiki has a main page for "getting involved"? Maybe we can add it to /topic Jan 22 09:59
nirik http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Join Jan 22 09:59
thomasj We tell people already to step up, but all are end user :) Jan 22 09:59
thomasj ok Jan 22 09:59
nirik yeah, but some of those people could really help out and provide something great to the project. You never know... Jan 22 10:00
nirik we should help them go to the right place to help... Jan 22 10:01
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thomasj Done with /topic Jan 22 10:02
nirik ok, anyone else want to chime in on this? or are thomasj and I the only ones here? :) Jan 22 10:03
thomasj looks like :D Jan 22 10:03
Southern_Gentlem i have been thinking about doing a jigdo classroom but i dont want to do it at midnite Jan 22 10:03
---nirik has changed the topic to: IRC Support SIG - state of the channel Jan 22 10:03
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nirik Southern_Gentlem: sign up for one down the road? there are a few more months listed on the page. Jan 22 10:04
nirik anyhow, on to a state of the channel... how are we doing? Jan 22 10:05
Southern_Gentlem i think we are doing a great job Jan 22 10:05
nirik I have had some feedback this week with someone who was saying the channel is as bad as it ever was. I disagree, but we should work harder... Jan 22 10:05
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Southern_Gentlem bad in what way Jan 22 10:06
nirik let me go look... just a sec. Jan 22 10:06
nirik saying the ops are pushing people around and banning/kicking for minor issues. Jan 22 10:08
Southern_Gentlem i disagree Jan 22 10:08
nirik excessive control of language. Jan 22 10:08
Southern_Gentlem i only kick for the f word Jan 22 10:09
*Southern_Gentlem reminds offender Be polite and avoid profanity someone's kids and their grandmother might be in here listening Jan 22 10:09
nirik I don't think so either, but I wanted to bring it up here and note that for some people at least we still need to improve. Jan 22 10:09
Southern_Gentlem excessive control of language because khay banned perlsyntax for repeatedly curseing like a sailor Jan 22 10:10
thomasj hmm.. end user (some people)? Jan 22 10:10
Southern_Gentlem and i think the channel is doing a good job of self policeing itself lately Jan 22 10:10
nirik anyhow, I think the biggest thing we can do is be professional, and follow our rules. If our rules need changing we should do so at that level Jan 22 10:11
thomasj I can only speak for what i do. And the only thing i did wrong was kicking DavidFreeman once. Jan 22 10:11
vwbusguy I remember that Jan 22 10:11
thomasj And i apologized for it later in ops. Jan 22 10:11
Southern_Gentlem thomasj, he does come across as little tto strong at times Jan 22 10:11
nirik everyone makes mistakes... ;) Jan 22 10:11
vwbusguy yeah, in hindsight I do think he was a troll Jan 22 10:11
Southern_Gentlem thomasj, and he has a redhat mask? Jan 22 10:12
thomasj i had him perm banned and did unban him accidentially. Jan 22 10:12
thomasj thomasj, nope Jan 22 10:12
thomasj args Jan 22 10:12
nirik I think we should also not be quick to label people trolls... sure there are some, but kicking them at the drop of a hat means you will be kicking people who are not really trolls and need help Jan 22 10:12
thomasj Southern_Gentlem, nope Jan 22 10:12
vwbusguy nirik, generally I think we've been good about it Jan 22 10:13
Southern_Gentlem thomasj, well he was in last nite and was behaving himself to its all good Jan 22 10:13
nirik anyhow, overall I think we are doing ok. :) We could use more helpers, but thats always the case. Jan 22 10:13
vwbusguy giving people a few chances first Jan 22 10:13
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*vwbusguy could use more helpers and customers in #Fedora-EOL Jan 22 10:13
Southern_Gentlem i have been warning people Jan 22 10:13
vwbusguy although customers has been picking up a _little_ more Jan 22 10:13
nirik vwbusguy: hows that going? Jan 22 10:14
Southern_Gentlem lol Jan 22 10:14
vwbusguy only troll is X, haha Jan 22 10:14
thomasj lol Jan 22 10:14
thomasj true Jan 22 10:14
vwbusguy nirik, about as well as expected, Jan 22 10:14
Southern_Gentlem i am hoping by the end of the month that a f10 re-spin will help stip your traffic even more Jan 22 10:14
vwbusguy I did find some old legacy mirrors still up Jan 22 10:14
vwbusguy and archive.fp.o is still up Jan 22 10:14
vwbusguy and FreshRPMs still has repos up for old versions Jan 22 10:14
thomasj Southern_Gentlem, we're waiting for a new kernel? Fixing the sound issue? Jan 22 10:15
vwbusguy a few stupid questions "Can I get KDE 4.1 in old version X?" Jan 22 10:15
thomasj s/we/you/ Jan 22 10:15
Southern_Gentlem thomasj, yep Jan 22 10:15
thomasj good Jan 22 10:15
nirik Southern_Gentlem: came out last night I think. ;) Jan 22 10:15
Southern_Gentlem not that i have seen Jan 22 10:15
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nirik well, it was approved to push last night. No idea if a push has been done with it yet. Jan 22 10:16
nirik anyhow, anything folks want to bring up before we close? Jan 22 10:16
---nirik has changed the topic to: IRC Support SIG - Open Floor Jan 22 10:16
Southern_Gentlem not pushed Jan 22 10:17
nirik http://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/kernel-2.6.27.12-170.2.5.fc10 Jan 22 10:17
Southern_Gentlem my f10 test still shows 159 Jan 22 10:17
Southern_Gentlem in updates Jan 22 10:18
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nirik ok, will close the meeting in 60 Jan 22 10:19
nirik ok, thanks for coming folks. Jan 22 10:20

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